Text | Chen Zhou Niu Tuoshe
Inspired by a cultural phenomenon peculiar to China: the Ma Gang.
It was Zhang Jie's trip to Yunnan, heard the tour guide talk about the Ma Gang, thanked its "go out together, send things to the destination" cultural connotation, and the concept of what he wants to do, that is, to unite together, to transport Chinese goods overseas, so he named the ERP company he founded "Ma Bang", he was also called "Helper" by industry insiders.
Zhang Jie was born in Shanghai in the early 1980s. At the beginning of the 21st century, Zhang Jie, who was studying at university, began to try domestic e-commerce from eBay, and then became a cross-border seller through eBay, and during the cross-border seller, the ability to find problems and solve problems, as well as the willingness to extend her business tentacles deeper and farther, made Zhang Jie become a "person who serves sellers" again.
In 2001, it entered the field of e-commerce, in 2004 it did cross-border e-commerce, in 2012 it commercialized its own software, and then completely transformed the SaaS model, in 2015, it received angel round investment from the venture dark horse fund, and then received different rounds of investment of different amounts, the most recent of which was the B round of 300 million yuan investment led by SoftBank Asia in August 2021. Looking back at this road, deep and shallow, "many times I really want to give up", but I am still willing to believe that "as long as I don't get off the table, the east wind will come".
In 2003, Taobao was established in Hangzhou, in 2004 to do promotion, founder Ma Yun went to Shanghai to communicate with the sellers who did well at that time, and Zhang Jie, who did a good job on eBay, met and took a photo with Ma Yun as one of the seller representatives. In 2014, Taobao went public, and the photo of Zhang Jie and Ma Yun was rumored to be "Ma Yun and his son" on the Internet, which is a joke, and the more than 30 sellers who met Ma Yun with him that year are still insisting on the "e-commerce" field, "there are only three or four", which is another story.
In 2011, Zhang Jie was "one of the representatives of internet changes in the first 10 years of the 21st century", and now he is in the most "hot" track in the investment industry, he is good at talking, appearing in public speech occasions many times, telling some of his own views and discoveries on the industry.
In mid-September 2021, Niutuo had a conversation with Zhang Jie. In the dialogue, Zhang Jie talked about his experience in doing e-commerce, thinking about changing from e-commerce to SaaS model, and so on. NiuTuoshe hopes that through the dialogue body, it is more likely to show Zhang Jie's more initial expression, but also try to salvage more details, restore the scene of the past, and tell the latecomers the growth logic behind a Chinese cross-border SaaS company.
In the context of the times, the struggles and ups and downs of more individuals are the stories of a generation, and in Zhang Jie's experience and thinking, you can see more people.
Here's what the conversation is about:
<h1 class="pgc-h-arrow-right" data-track="293" > 2001, the first online business, I made 35 yuan</h1>
NiuTuosha: Public information shows that in 2001, you began to get involved in e-commerce, when you were less than 20 years old, under what circumstances did you start doing e-commerce? Looking back now, what was e-commerce like 20 years ago?
Jie Zhang: I first started e-commerce from eBay, and at that time I just wanted to make some money, because I just entered the university. Students have gone to work, such as McDonald's, KFC, can earn more than 10 yuan an hour, I think this is not what I want. I also had a small business at the time, that is, a stall, but it was not very easy.
One day in November 2001, I once saw an advertisement for "eBay" on the bus, I went home and tried it, registered an account, tried to put the things I had set up on the internet, and I didn't expect it to be really closed.
The first transaction was under the big screen of (Shanghai)'s People's Square, which was mainly used for people to date or other landmarks to meet, because mobile phones were not so popular at that time, and many people first called to say where to meet, and generally chose a particularly easy place to find.
In the same way, I made an appointment with someone to trade under there, and waited for almost half an hour. The deal made about 35 yuan, and although it was gone after a meal, I felt that this e-commerce was promising, so I went in more goods and updated more products.
Now that I think about it, my interest in business may have something to do with my mother's influence. My mother is in business, she opened a shop in Shanghai, I and my mother have been to the (Shanghai) City God Temple, (Zhejiang) Yiwu to buy goods, know what is going on, compared to the same age has a little bit of the concept of "source".
After the business is on the right track, what I have to do every day is to buy goods, because there is not so much money to buy so many goods at once, just sell a little goods and buy a little goods.
At that time, after receiving orders, you may not be able to receive money, e-commerce is more of an experience for people at that time, when placing orders, everyone basically does not pay. What I had to do then was to collect payments. I already had a concept of a system.
I made a CRM system manually, that is, all the order information, printed on a card the size of a business card, bundled into a bundle, each of which is marked on it, such as the person has paid (to be checked), and has arrived (to be shipped), address, name, transfer bank, there are several statuses. When the number of cards to be checked accumulates to a certain number, I will go to the bank's ATM machine to check the accounts one by one, and there was no online banking at that time.
When they send money, it's just a card to call, call it and ask you if you transferred the money? How much is turned? Generally let them turn a fraction, for example, should transfer 100 yuan, I let them transfer 100.03 yuan, because the ATM machine can not see the name of the other party, can only see the amount, I know who this is through the amount, who is that.
I was taking the bus to school every day. In order to solve the problem of collecting payment on the way to school, I took the card on the bus and called one by one to collect the payment, and after receiving the remittance, I could ship the goods. I went to the City God Temple to finish the goods, so I went to the nearby post office to pack and ship. There are some goods that may need to be traded in person, then come down along the Subway line of The City God Temple, one is the big screen of People's Square, the second is the Pacific Department Store of Huaihai Road, and the third is the KFC gate on the basement floor of Xujiahui Port.
Sometimes the list is larger, and it will be delivered to the door, at that time there was no express delivery, flash delivery, and there was no concept of logistics.
<h1 class="pgc-h-arrow-right" data-track="45" > at that time, $0.99 was free shipping worldwide</h1>
NiuTuos: In 2004, the year you began to get involved in cross-border e-commerce, what kind of thinking is this battlefield shifting? And what kind of background?
Zhang Jie: In 2004, I began to transform into cross-border e-commerce, mainly because eBay was a bit downhill, eBay and eBay formed an alliance and changed its name to eBay eBay. Taobao was developed in 2003, promoted in 2004, that year about April and May, Ma Yun came to Shanghai, found a few (Shanghai) big sellers, and took a photo at that time. In 2014, Ali went public, and the photo of me and him was circulated on the Internet, saying that it was Ma Yun's son, and until now, the photo of "Ma Yun's son" on the Internet is still my one.
After doing cross-border e-commerce, I found that this business is better than domestic. Later, I slowly gave up domestic e-commerce, and in 2005, I almost only did cross-border e-commerce.
Niutuoshe: What kind of details and stories do cross-border e-commerce? What are the differences between it and domestic e-commerce?
Zhang Jie: The core problem of cross-border e-commerce is that the freight is relatively expensive, at that time, China Post was 100 grams as a unit of pricing, every 100 grams, the registered word is 28 yuan, not registered is 18 yuan. You can also buy stamps to paste on it, different stamps have different prices, I used an excel form to do an algorithm system, that is, when a package of how much money, what stamp you paste is the most cost-effective, such as a stamp of 10 dollars, a stamp of 5 dollars, and a stamp of 8 cents, the lower the denomination, the lower the discount, and different stamps, the discount rate is not the same. For example, an 8-dollar stamp may be able to get a 20% discount, and an 8-cent stamp may not be discounted at all. Figure out for yourself how you can improve efficiency.
Another problem was that money couldn't be returned, so I started doing bilateral trade. That is to say, when things are sold, the US dollars cannot be returned to the country, and there is no way. So buy things on eBay, such as things like Lycra cameras, which are more liquid and larger. At that time, I had to stay in front of the computer every night until midnight, waiting for eBay's auction, buying those things back, and then selling them after buying them.
Only this kind of bilateral trade can eventually become money.
By about 2006, there was a solution, there was a check, but the cash flow rate of checks was particularly poor. My cash flow sensitivity was cultivated at that time. A check application to your hand, it takes almost two months, you then go to the bank to collect (entrust the bank to find a foreign banking institution to cash out the check), and then the US dollar finally to your hand, it takes almost 4 months, that is, the cash pressure there the turnover cycle takes more than 4 months.
I thought, since the turnover of funds is so strongly suppressed, then the turnover rate of inventory must be improved. So I now continue to reinforce this point repeatedly, including my speeches in many public occasions, which will definitely say "pay attention to turnover", which is reflected in the Mabang software, which is the emphasis on capital turnover and inventory turnover.
After the check, there was a wire transfer, and the speed in the industry went faster.
The turning point of the entire industry was in 2008, when two problems were solved, one was that the money could be telegraphed to the country (bank), which was a very big breakthrough, but there was also a limitation, everyone's settlement was limited, so at that time it would borrow a lot of relatives' bank cards to settle the foreign exchange. The other is that Hongkong Post has gone to the mainland, which has brought a huge impact to China Post, Hongkong Post's billing model is different from the mainland's, with grams as the unit of price, 1 kilogram seems to be 103 yuan, China Post is calculated by kilograms, cheaper than it.
The advantage of gram as a unit of price is that you can sell things under 100 grams, the cost of a single package below 100 grams is far lower than the cost of China Post, China Post 28 yuan is equivalent to 3 US dollars, if the gram is the unit of price, if I sell things including parcels only 10 grams, if you do not use registration, it is only 1.3 yuan, that is, this price, the cost is reduced to a huge low.
At this time, you will find that you can sell many, many things. A lot of things are "$0.99 worldwide free shipping".
Because of this background, the cross-border e-commerce industry has risen, including Shenzhen and Yiwu. For example, selling flash memory cards, which are very light, you can sell very cheaply, and at that time there was a beaded bead that sold very well, all of which were $0.99 worldwide free shipping. The unit price of customers looks hugely low, but the gross profit margin is better.
Compared with the short domestic e-commerce trip, cross-border e-commerce for me, is not so high frequency to go to the City God Temple to buy goods, I am more in the back to do work, the daily shipment volume is quite large. I remember once in 2005, I was pedaling a tricycle to the post office near the City God Temple to deliver goods, and was seen by a classmate, there were many packages in the car at that time, I felt that I was a delivery, and I thought that I might have had a hard time.
The whole industry started to explode in 2008 and 2009, and I had 1,000 or 2,000 shipments a day. Feeling that the efficiency is too low, I have my own obsession with improving efficiency.
In fact, I had the concept of SKU in 2007, I think how can more products be better managed? I'll just code it. I remember when eBay pushed the SKU concept, they consulted a group of sellers, and I was the only one who used the code, and the others used Chinese name, title, and image to manage the product.
The first program I wrote myself was written in Excle, which I could program visually, and I used it to do an order management system and a product development process. The efficiency of the entire company increases.
In 2010, I felt that the system was not good enough and the operation was more troublesome. I asked a programmer to help us develop a system, which is the prototype of the ma gang system, improve the invoicing process, and then manage the product development process, everyone has no concept of product development, and thinks that product development is the boss's business.
In 2011, many people came to me and said you sold me this system, and when I communicated with them, I found that a lot of their work was very primitive, 99% of the sellers needed education, a very basic kind of education, educating them to first code the goods.
<h1 class="pgc-h-arrow-right" data-track="87" > "horse gang" came out</h1>
Niutuos: What made you completely commercialize software?
Zhang Jie: At first, I thought that after selling the software to them, I didn't care, I didn't expect that there was a lot of maintenance, development, and a lot of needs to come over, just in 2012 I commercialized the Mabang software.
At that time, I was traveling to Yunnan and listened to the tour guide talk about the "Horse Gang". At that time, the Mabang culture was quite similar to the scene of cross-border e-commerce at that time. In fact, everyone encounters difficulties and obstacles when exporting, and they have also experienced a lot of hard work to drive goods overseas.
In the local culture, "Ma Bang" is not a commercial organization, not the name of a company, "Ma Bang" in ancient Yunnan means "doing business". For example, in a village, when the tea leaves are ready in the spring and they want to transport them to Beijing, they say, "Let's go to the Horse Race." Because the road will be very long and dangerous, it is all a village of people going out together.
"Horse gang" is first of all the meaning of doing business, and secondly, everyone should unite to drive the goods to the destination together, and then sell the goods, which is the feeling that everyone will make things bigger together. In the past, China was the "world factory", now it is the "world store", one person, two people, each in charge, there is no way to make the industry (market) very big, only everyone together can make this industry bigger.
Niutuos: Software commercialization in 2012, angel round of venture dark horse fund in 2015, followed by different rounds of investment of different amounts, the most recent of which was the B round of 300 million yuan investment led by SoftBank Asia in August 2021, what does receiving investment mean to you and Ma Bang?
Zhang Jie: After becoming a horse gang, my vision began to grow. Before, when I was just a seller, my vision was not big. When I started to do horse gang in 2012, I began to contact a large number of sellers, including all stages and different sizes, and talked more deeply, and you will find that the original business model is so understood, and this mode of operation.
By 2014, I realized that the Next Horse Gang couldn't do what it used to, and I had to subvert it. At the end of 2014, we made a decision to fully SaaS and abandon OP and SP modes.
It's a little too late for custom product companies to do SaaS now. We started doing it in 2014, the first version went live in 2015, and now it's been more than 5 years, this period is my SaaS strategic creation period, if I didn't do it in 2014, I started doing it in 2018, I definitely can't do where I am now.
It's also a personal iteration of my understanding of business.
Ma Bang and I used to do e-commerce are two completely independent companies, Ma Bang is a team that is differentiated from the IT department in the original e-commerce business, and at the end of 2018, I have completely withdrawn from the e-commerce I founded.
In my opinion, there are three kinds of business, one is a subsistence business, one is a craftsman business, one is a large-scale business, that is, organization, but the team fights, large sellers are generally like this, but if you want to be a great company, you must have a sense of mission, to change the industry, so that some of the efficiency elements of society change because of this company.
I feel like Ma Bang has a chance to be a great company.
Our mission now is to make the circulation of goods more efficient. Before China's products were sold overseas, they arrived overseas through various links, and now China produces them directly retailing overseas, and there are a series of chains in between, such as logistics, etc. Can this series of processes be more efficient? I think the horse gang can do a lot of things.
NiuTuoshe: The investment of different institutions has come in one after another, will it have an impact on their original intentions?
Zhang Jie: No matter what you do, as long as the mission is determined, everything revolves around the mission. For example, bringing in executives and expanding the team, these are all moving forward for the purpose of the heart.
We've had several rounds of money coming in over the years, but are we making money for the money?
All of this revolves around how we make the circulation of goods more efficient. If my financing can help me achieve my mission, then I must raise funds, if I make this product can help achieve this mission, then I must make this product, if I find that I am not capable in the process, but there is someone who can help me solve the problem of ability, then I have to ask him to come over. All of this revolves around whether it is closer to our mission.
Circulation efficiency can always be higher.
This mission is slowly polished out by us over the years, at first a little vague, we are essentially reducing costs and increasing efficiency, how to make goods quickly reach consumers after production, rather than a lot of time is consumed in the process.
NiuTuoshe: You have said in public before that the "Amoeba model", what is the existing management model of the Ma Gang?
Zhang Jie: The Ma Gang now has more than 800 people, next year (2022) may grow to a team of 1500 to 2000 people, such a team, if it is still using the model of last year or the previous year, nothing has changed, then this organization will definitely fall apart. What kind of organizational management model should be used is to be considered. Ma Bang is not the same as the seller, Ma Bang also has a factory, that is, the research and development team, how to motivate them, this is now in addition to the product, the most focused on one thing.
Our management model is constantly iterative in the existing state. In e-commerce, the iteration of the amoeba model is the partner model, and we are basically a "front store, back factory" model now. I have my own good standards in mind, about ourselves or in the moment of knowing ourselves, to explore step by step.
Quality produces efficiency, efficiency produces scale, scale produces benefits, what we need to explore is: what kind of quality I provide, the efficiency is not high enough, if the product quality is high enough, we will expand the scale, for example, some users say that the cost of our products has been reduced by 30%, we will expand the scale, if they use our products to increase the cost, we will expand the scale will have problems.
The effect of the horse gang is produced under the premise that the first three aspects are very well done. Patterns, coupling all aspects, if one aspect is not done well, forced to go down, in fact, it is impossible.
<h1 class="pgc-h-arrow-right" data-track="137" after a successful trial and error >, a large number of people will rush in</h1>
Niu Tuoshe: What is the center of gravity of the Current Horse Gang?
Zhang Jie: I think I am half a product manager, and I am more persistent about products, which requires an understanding of the needs of the industry and insight into the dynamics of the industry. Because insight ultimately determines the direction of the product, determines what kind of solution the horse gang can have, rather than following the industry.
In addition to Mabang ERP, we are now optimizing the supply chain system for sellers, how sellers manage suppliers, how suppliers manage sellers, and the two sides form a network effect to improve the efficiency of the entire procurement supply chain. This is my focus now, this focus jumps out of the problem of how to help sellers deal with some orders, if we improve the efficiency of the procurement supply chain as a whole, other problems become secondary problems.
The space is very large.
NiuTuos: Mabang ERP is also ready to do the South American market?
Zhang Jie: South America is definitely a big trend, the population is large, the e-commerce penetration rate is not so high, China's e-commerce will definitely rush in, so in what way to rush in, I don't know.
The current changes in this industry, including Amazon's wave of store closures, are normal phenomena and are inevitable products of the development of this industry to this stage, and each stage of such a phenomenon has a very big improvement effect on China's e-commerce. For the next wave, to do Southeast Asia, to do South America, to do independent stations, it is very helpful.
Because for example, to do South America, it needs several capabilities: a strong deep supply chain capability, China's delivery in the past or other ways, now it is demonstrated, China's delivery in the past was a bit inefficient, and now the high efficiency is the inventory originally existed in the United States of those sellers, and then the United States inventory directly sold to South America.
Next, TikTok may also be the direction of the rise, which also requires some capabilities, one is to manage more SKUs, the other is a one-click distribution or distribution model, which is also to see if some sellers have developed this aspect of things in the past few years, if you want to rise, now see if there are sellers can connect with TikTok demand.
If TikTok rises, it needs a one-click solution, we have a one-click SaaS class in the solution - OurMall, if the seller can receive a large number of TikTok on the Influencer list, it can quickly enhance the business value.
NiuTuos: Comparison between Southeast Asia, South America and China's current e-commerce environment?
Zhang Jie: As long as the market exists, as long as it is demonstrated that it is a real market and not a pseudo market, and that it is a real demand rather than a pseudo demand, there will be a large number of companies rushing in.
A large number of sellers rushed in to try and make mistakes, in the process of trial and error, you will find that there is indeed a great demand here, naturally, from this demand will iterate a large number of logistics companies, warehousing companies, solution companies, including companies such as Ma Bang rushed in, adding bricks and tiles to this market, I have never worried about this aspect.
Because the industry is too big, people in various chains have passed, and once the trial and error is successful, there will be a large number of people pouring in.
Just like a few years ago, Amazon was argued to be a real market, you see most of the seller service companies in the market now are targeting Amazon. Why are so many people rushing in because it's a real market.
NiuTuoshe: What do you think of the phenomenon of "Amazon store closure tide"?
Zhang Jie: In the cross-border e-commerce industry, or the entire e-commerce industry, you will find a phenomenon that is actually the same as traditional commerce, that is, thirty years of Hedong and thirty years of Hexi. Before 2012, it was basically the world of eBay, and later, some sellers would flock to other platforms, such as switching to AliExpress, and later to Amazon, bringing the industry to fire again, and many people rushed in.
The recent "Amazon store closure tide incident" has brought about the improvement of sellers' two capabilities: one is the ability of overseas warehouses, and the other is the ability of brands. Before many sellers are grassroots sellers, product quality is not very high, the depth of supply chain is not very deep, but through Amazon's education, education has produced a strong brand ability, product quality has risen relatively high, overseas supply chain, or deep supply chain, there has also been a great improvement.
We don't look at individual sellers, we look at the whole industry, and the capabilities of the whole industry are improved. It has a good effect on the next step of development. The next development is the output and independent station of Chinese brands, or the platform or single platform of quality suppliers like Shein, which will be more and more.
This is a reasonable necessity.
Amazon is now at this stage, the ability to improve the entire industry, and enter the next era, the next era may be Southeast Asia, independent stations, brand output, and even the output of overseas offline Chinese brands, and even South America, and now Africa is also rising, that is similar to this continuous round of the market, the platform opens, the brand opens, some sellers rise, it has a large number of outputs for the entire industry.
In this case, Mabang is also with the continuous changes in the industry, to the seller to output multi-platform solutions, multi-platform operation capabilities, multi-platform branding capabilities, overseas warehouse deep supply chain operation capabilities, logistics management capabilities and so on.
The SaaS model is that if you're good enough, people will keep using it.
NiuTuos: In this industry, do you think cross-border SaaS is now on fire?
Zhang Jie: Investors' money is the smartest money, so it is not easy to deceive investors' money, they must want to understand this matter.
Why is SaaS valuable? Its user lifetime value is very large, as long as your product is done well, the thickness is thick enough, the user's viscosity is high enough, the user's lifetime value will be very large, and some of our users have started to use our products since 2011.
In terms of business model, the SaaS model is a good business model, and a similar business model is a property, because every household has to pay. So do we.
If you're good enough, he'll keep using it.
NiuTuoshe: It will inevitably bring industry competition.
Zhang Jie: SaaS products are divided into several types, such as custom products, and there are several companies in the industry that take this kind of private cloud deployment and project customization route.
We should be the only heavy-duty SaaS in the industry, solving very deep problems, docking more than 80 platforms, more than 1,000 logistics companies, only one independent version, registration can be used.
Other heavy ERP is project-level management, can be localized deployment, their disadvantage is that the pressure of upgrading and maintenance in the future is very large, if you encounter a new platform, it is possible that 200 users have 100 versions, that 100 users need to rewrite code to redevelop, the efficiency will be very low.
There is also a similar for a single platform, similar to the domestic vibrato is particularly hot, then he only for the vibrato out of a program, we also have a lot of such companies in the industry, for Amazon out of a lot of solutions. But he has no solutions for other platforms, or for scenarios.
There are also many such companies, they don't have a warehousing platform, they don't have supply chain management, they just manage it on a single platform.
There is also a category of solutions for small and medium-sized sellers, which favor free and small fees. The function is simple, suitable for early sellers, and the setting of the product is only to set the function, and does not involve the scene.
Depth (heavy) ERP is whether you can set this product (deep) to the post. Many SaaS in the industry can only achieve demand productization, can not do product scenarios, and scenarios are posted.
NiuTuos: What is your understanding of the SaaS model?
Jie Zhang: The ultimate model of the SaaS model is a consulting company + a software company. I am a seller, the advantage of Doing SaaS is that I have the output of the solution, the output of the business model, if these can become consulting content, whether it is at the sales end, or in the implementation end, or the customer success side behind, not only can bring users the concept of software, but also to bring users the company to enhance the program, which is a valuable business model for SaaS to go.
SaaS companies that do well at home and abroad have told me that SaaS companies not only provide a set of software, but also consulting content, that is, in the process of giving you software online, I have brought a lot of consulting content, that is, how to help you go to the next step, how to upgrade the management model, how to iterate on the business model.
NiuTuoshe: From the current "cross-border SaaS" favored by investors to look back at cross-border e-commerce 10 years ago, what was it like then?
Zhang Jie: At that time, everyone did not have the concept of investment and financing, they were all from the grassroots, and what they compared to each other was that you were more profitable than me, how big your trading volume was, and how much was the daily order volume. Slowly, the industry began to go out of the circle, and there will be new models coming in, including the concept of investment, which is also brought in by outsiders.
Someone raised money, and we thought, wow, can the industry still raise money? Someone goes public, and we think, wow, can this industry still be listed? Slowly, I changed everyone's various ideas. Our first group of people thought it was a business, similar to setting up a stall.
<h1 class="pgc-h-arrow-right" data-track="217" > it changed my life</h1>
NIU: What would you like to use to describe the (cross-border SaaS) industry you are in?
Zhang Jie: The vast majority of people in this industry are very low-key and unwilling to show their faces. There are many people in our circle who feel that they are god-level figures, and they may not necessarily know outside the circle. Exposing them doesn't help, and they spend more time and energy on how to develop the product and how to optimize the internal processes. We communicate a lot, but only within the industry.
In the past two years, some brands outside the circle have entered the cross-border e-commerce field.
If I were just a seller I wouldn't be interviewed, in 2005, I was a member of eBay's first lecturer group, 23 years old, need to speak across the country, a lot of things for me to go with the flow, maybe this is still one of my comfort zones.
In my opinion, a good organizational manager needs to have 4 capabilities: product ability, ability to acquire users, organizational ability, and financing ability. Having these abilities is definitely good for the development of the company, so I think it is also very critical to be able to go on stage and speak.
NiuTuoshe: How do you think about the relationship between doing e-commerce industry and your life growth?
Zhang Jie: It changed my life, step by step. I started out as a small businessman, but then I slowly began to form my own systemic cognition.
I am involved in the whole process of industry change. Go from a seller to a service provider. There are many people like me in the industry, especially in Shenzhen.
There are several scenarios, one is like me, just want to make some money, with the change of the times, slowly from domestic e-commerce to cross-border e-commerce and then to service providers.
There is also a kind of, the earliest to do eBay, in fact, hong kong people, they are very sensitive to business information like this, in order to reduce costs, they will generally go to Shenzhen to set up an office, the general choice of place is Huaqiang North, in the local area will also recruit a group of people to sell flash memory cards, there are several people in the team, and later a few people came out to become super sellers.
His company is like the incubation base of the first batch of Shenzhen sellers, this batch of sellers recruited many people, these people know that there is a cross-border e-commerce this value depression, in 2007, 2008 came out, became the second batch of sellers, and then like mushrooms after the rain, many people rushed in.
NiuTuos: Does the state have any relevant policies to encourage it?
Zhang Jie: The national incentive policy was around 2013 and 2014.
Niutuos: What about the last two years?
Zhang Jie: This year's two sessions proposed cross-border e-commerce as the second major strategy of the country.
The significance of our software is that no matter how much the state invests in this aspect in the future, how many sellers will come in, this market must be very large, so investors will not blindly invest in this industry. Today, this industry has become a very good investment target in the investment industry.
The role of the epidemic is to quickly enhance the penetration rate of foreign markets from offline to online, and there is no change in the essence of this matter, because e-commerce is an inevitable trend, and e-commerce is a business model that must exist in the future, just like the previous commissary is a business model that will exist everywhere, and e-commerce will become an inevitable business model in commodity circulation.
<h1 class="pgc-h-arrow-right" data-track="250" > difficult times</h1>
Niutuos: From domestic e-commerce to cross-border e-commerce to cross-border ERP, in the past 20 years, you have experienced every major node in this industry from micro-time, do you have any experiences to share?
Zhang Jie: No matter what you do, as long as you are interested in business.
First of all, to discover its business value (discovery strategy), which is to be tried and tested;
Second, it is necessary to develop a strategy, it may be that the boss has a perception of the strategy, or it may not be perceived, but (all have to go in this direction);
The third is to explore my own ability stage (ability procurement), that is, in order to win this market, what kind of organizational ability, business ability or product ability, personnel ability, either the boss himself to improve, to go to class, or to find the right person to assist;
Fourth, it is the resource allocation stage, if your ambition is to be a large-scale or a great company, you should think about what kind of resources you should allocate;
Fifth, when people, money, goods, and markets come, they want to use what kind of incentive model to solve the problem of vitality.
To put it simply, it is the five elements of people, money, goods, market, and vitality.
The development of the whole company is around these five points, and it is constantly explored. Now sometimes when I make some specific decisions, I wonder which point in the middle of the problem I am solving now.
These are all summed up, explored, and chatted with friends. I have my own insight into abstract things, first of all, insight into the problem, when you find a problem, you will take the problem and talk to a lot of people. In the process of chatting, you will find that your problem may not be a problem at all in others, and people will tell you a model or solution.
Niu Tuoshe: Are there any times when you find it particularly difficult?
Zhang Jie: There are still some. When the mental strength is not very strong, there are one or two links every year that make you want to give up, but my personal mental strength is still quite strong, and it is easier to stick to one thing.
In 2004, we had more than 30 sellers to meet Ma Yun, but there were only about three people who were still doing e-commerce, and one of the key points here was whether you had a strong mental strength to make the strategic definition bigger, insist on doing one thing, and even say whether you gave up at the most difficult time.
When doing e-commerce, there are also stages where the account is dead, the pit is stepped on, the wrong road is taken, and a large amount of money is lost. Sometimes I want to calculate, I change the industry.
In 2014, when I transformed to SaaS, I was very miserable at that time, we had more than 600 sellers, there were a lot of customization needs, each version was not the same, needed to shop a large number of people, often encountered hard disks broken, things were bitten by rats, database broken and other issues, according to the 1% concept every day will encounter two.
We do the software industry, there are a lot of people killed in 2012, the momentum is fierce, and then every year there are many families to kill in, but the killing does not necessarily stick to it, many people have given up, too difficult.
And the thing that's particularly hard is that you have to wait, it's hard to survive. Texas Hold'em has a concept that you don't change tables easily. Although luck is now a downwind, but the big names will always come, because luck is good, the trend is good, it is all fluctuating. Now that the trend is down, you wait, just wait at this table, protect the chips, protect the team, and wait for the big cards to come.
When the big names come, seize the moment. But first you have to be a good player to get a big market, to go ahead, to get things done. But when the market trend goes down, just like in previous years, you have to have the concentration to wait and not get off the table.
This kind of concentration may be caused by my original personality, and I am particularly able to insist on the things I identify.
This article is from the WeChat public account "Niutuoshe" (ID: Neuters)
![Zhang Jie: The expression of the liver and intestines in our time[fig]](data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAP///wAAACwAAAAAAQABAAACAkQBADs=)