Interview, Writing/French Film
"Will be depressed, as soon as there is a problem in the heart, the body will immediately react, burst a lot of acne. I slept for a short time, groggy every day, cranky, and sometimes I always thought about the end of the world, which destroyed me and didn't want to do it. ”
Speaking of this, the excitement of the release of the new film disappeared from his face in an instant, replaced by a confused look and a low cheek when the memory hit.
Can you imagine? Ma Kai, the director of "Zhong Evil", which was hailed as the light of domestic thrillers seven years ago, will use these four words to describe what he has encountered over the years - escaping from death.
Didn't provoke gangs, didn't fall into the mountains, didn't suffer from serious illness, didn't leave the battlefield, in this era, there is still a matter of escaping from death?
Yes, just because Ma Kay is loyal to the movie.
So when his afterglow at the film festival gradually dissipated, and the appreciation of the big boss was followed by a complete denial, coupled with the dark operation of human nature in various circles hovering overhead, he was really afraid.
Fortunately, there are constantly company bosses to lend a hand, and the most important support, Chen Lizhi from Matt Pictures, finally let a director who has been nagged for seven years, but has always been isolated from the big screen, enter the theater mecca.
Grassroots, non-class, horizontal drift, this is Ma Kai's overturned character, and now he is the director of the "mainstream commercial theater debut" "Great Night", and he is a set helmsman who makes Liang Long make the most exaggerated expression of his acting career and believes that Fan Chengcheng will definitely be able to take the actor.
Although "Great Night" did not make too many waves in the market, and the reputation was by no means flat, this was the first broad audience that Ma Kai really saw him.
He will not forget the brothers of "Zhong Evil", and next plans to create a low-budget action movie for them, or even a magical action production a little further.
On the night of Ma Kai and his creator Tianjin Roadshow, I rode my shared bicycle to his hotel and talked late into the night, the day after the end of the world.
Director Ma Kai
01
Performance to high
You can play as much as you want, I'll just catch it; Fan Chengcheng will definitely be able to win the actor in the future
Director 1: I want to ask Yi Xiaoxing what is the main aspect of this producer's work?
Ma Kai: He made my script more complete, and put forward a lot of good ideas, many of which were in the character arc and the growth of the characters at the end, and this star brother helped a lot.
Director 1: Each character has its own dramatic moment at the end, right?
Ma Kai: Yes, it's fuller than before.
Director 1: Will there be any problems with the scale of this film?
Ma Kai: Actually, it's okay, because we're quite positive, after all, it's a thriller comedy, and it's still brotherhood, so there's no problem.
Director 1: What was it like working with a professional actor for the first time? Who was the biggest actor in your early years?
Ma Kai: Big-name stars, I have seen almost everything I should have seen when I did group performances, and if you want to say that I play the biggest name in the opponent's play, I want to think... Zhang Yi.
Director 1: What play?
Ma Kai: "Chicken Feathers Fly to the Sky", played by him and Yin Tao, lecture Wu haberdashery. In that scene, he came to my stall to buy socks, and the character I played couldn't look at him when he saw him like that. I also designed a lot of details before filming, but when I was shooting, the director said, you just stand there, don't move, and talk to Zhang Yi.
Director 1: This time I have to direct a dozen actors, I don't know how you went to establish cooperation?
Ma Kai: A little panicked, definitely panicked. Because you don't have this experience, for example, you will worry about what the image on the stage of Dragon Brother will look like underneath. But it really surprised me to find out that Brother Long was a gentleman.
Director 1: They will definitely ask, who is this director, I have to investigate you.
Ma Kai: Absolutely, at least I know that I have made a thriller with a good reputation in the industry, maybe I haven't seen it, but I am also a potential young director, not the kind of blind filmmaker.
Of course, judging from the state of our chat at the beginning, there must be some doubts about me, and they are worried that my scene O is not OK, and the back should be filmed for about a week, and they may completely believe in my state.
I may not be very good at live drama, but they can all get what I want. For example, this one, I may say something that they can't understand, but as long as they don't meet the standard, this one will definitely not pass, so keep it until they understand.
Director 1: How do I feel that your scene is the plot of the movie.
Makay: Haha, yes. In fact, for me, when I select them, I mainly look at their characteristics, and then look at their works, how much energy their performances have.
Director 1: So let's say Jiang Long, which of his works to see to determine his energy?
Ma Kai: Just look at the works of the three-board big axe in the "Annual Comedy Competition", for me, looking at a person's car skills, as soon as this person goes up, you turn a corner and you know whether he will drive it, whether it is good to drive or not, how many years it has been driven, you have a judgment in your heart.
Just like watching them perform, you don't need to say how much you have to know him, in fact, just watch a play, you will know what his thoughts are like when dealing with the play, this is actually what I have been good at for so many years.
What I'm good at is that I can find the good in the actor, and then guide him, magnify him, maximize the good points.
Director 1: So it's definitely about you on the scene, and you're the only one who can make the final judgment, right?
Ma Kai: Yes, you can play as much as you like, you can throw it to me if you have any ideas, you can play yours, and finally see how I catch you, I will take into account an overall feeling, you can play hi, but the audience will feel uncomfortable when watching it as a whole, it's too embarrassing, this must be very well controlled. You hi yours, I'll end up rationalizing it in this.
In fact, it's more like comedy, to be honest, when I finished filming "Zhong Evil", I said I wanted to do comedy, and no one would believe it. Right? How hard comedy is.
In fact, I didn't feel anything about this film at the end, because I watched it too many times and was so immersed in it that I didn't feel it until I saw the feedback from the audience during the roadshow.
Director 1: Did you find some accidents during the roadshow, which you thought was okay, but the audience reacted strongly?
Ma Kai: Yes, do you remember that Liang Long, Jiang Long and Kong Lianshun had a scene, Jiang Long said to Liang Long, you have never seen a ghost, how do you know what it is like to be chased by a ghost? Liang Long was supposedly stunned and had to be furious, but he then gave a reaction that kind, "What you said is quite reasonable." It was that scene, which was very popular on the scene and the reaction was very large.
I chatted with Brother Long when I was filming, and said that you don't talk normally, just make it different, weird, and a little sarcastic. So how do you make it weird? Just think, then you can use dialects, then tried several dialects, Henan or whatever, until I tried Shanghainese, I felt that his sense of character, human face and previous character setting are funny.
I don't know if the audience will eat it or not, but I judged it to be fun at the time, and he had to speak like this.
Director 1: Will Brother Long find it interesting himself?
Ma Kai: Brother Long is not sure either.
Director 1: But he can execute, he can put in.
Ma Kai: Yes, he completely believes in you, I will do everything you ask me to do.
For example, he makes an expression in front of the monitor, in fact, there is nothing on that monitor, he has to act, at first he will do it very little, I say Brother Long, you exaggerate a little, and then he gives a reaction, I say Brother Long, you exaggerate a little more, I say you are exaggerated so much that you can't exaggerate anymore. So when you look at his expression in that scene, it was already his limit at that time.
I'm sure he must have doubts in his heart, what am I doing? What kind of thing am I playing? Why such an exaggeration? But when I cut it out, that rhythm makes sense. The actor sometimes can't imagine this feeling of stringing back and forth, and he can only trust the director.
The first show of our roadshow was in Shenyang, which was the first time Brother Long watched the whole film, and he was "ah-" I could feel that Brother Long liked this play very much.
To be honest, this play, in the case of seven or eight main actors, the whole process is still so harmonious, this is a very difficult thing, it is a very good thing for comedy, do comedy, the atmosphere must be comfortable, you will be hi in a very comfortable situation. You can't be in a hurry, if there is a person who is very dick, then the rhythm will be chaotic, and other actors will be affected.
Director 1: What do you think of Fan Chengcheng?
Makay: I was pleasantly surprised. First of all, the first point, some actors, the unique things that he exudes, you can't change. What you can change is how much you can make him output.
Director 1: His beard?
Ma Kai: Fake, it's sticky hair dregs, that is, the hair is broken and sticks up little by little, so it's very like the real thing, this is what the makeup teacher thinks, hoping that he will become a little more mature.
This time in the costume styling, let him pull down and completely lose his idol image. He himself liked this look very much, he was only 22 years old when he filmed this play in 2000.
The second point is that his understanding of acting is very accurate, which is innate, at this age he has such ability, when reading the script, he can bring it up, at this time the leopard speaks a little strangely, no, you will think his opinion is more accurate.
Director 1: Is it more comfortable to work with professional actors this time, not that your previous brother is not good, but once you really enter industrialization, you need professional actors to improve efficiency.
Ma Kai: Yes, this must be an advantage, after all, they already have a lot of acting experience. But the potential of these actors, it also has a grade. How high can you go, is there any hope of winning a movie star in the future, I think Fan Chengcheng will definitely take the actor in the future.
Director 1: Is there a time when the set can't move?
Ma Kai: No, the only thing is the weather.
Director 1: Aren't most of them set up?
Ma Kai: There was an outdoor scene, and in the last scene, the three Fan Chengcheng brothers hugged and cried together, it was really raining, and it may seem small in the shot, but in fact, the rain was very heavy, the clothes were very wet, and the underwear was wet.
At that time, there was no time, the next day the scene of someone else's house was coming, you had to shoot today, if you didn't shoot, you had to wait a week, then you couldn't even play it. And it was still very cold that day, we were all wearing small down jackets inside, and in that case, they were drenched for four or five hours. The next day, Gan Yunchen had the greatest reaction, burning to 39 degrees 5.
But on the other hand, this rain can help them, just when they need this emotion, I say, brothers, do it, come on, do it directly!
Director 1: What do you think this play wants to express in the end?
Makay: It's brotherhood, it's something that is a theme. For me, brothers are important, very, very important.
But I don't think the subject matter is the hardest thing to do, the hardest thing is thriller and comedy, this kind of dramatic technical stuff.
Can you let the audience feel your joy, your fear, whether everyone is laughing when they are afraid, after you do this well, give it a theme, it will be easy to do, I think this thing can be considered passed.
If I only look at the theme, why do I have to watch your film? How is your brotherhood more expensive than other people's brotherhood? Right.
02
Action Dreams
It is planned to let the brothers of "Zhong Evil" act in scenes, and even magic action big productions
Director 1: After "Night", what do you want to do next?
Ma Kai: I have a plan, I want to make an action movie, and I think I can make action scenes.
Director 1: Wow, do you have a familiar action director?
Ma Kai: Actually, I think that making genre films, love, action, horror, this kind of thing, you need a feeling. For example, if I shoot horror scenes, I have to know which shots are high-level, and which shots are low-level, right?
Director 1: What is that low?
Ma Kai: For example, if you are walking and suddenly a face pops out and "whoosh" you are scared, you will also be scared. But people will think, you are neurotic, this is you out of recruitment. The advanced is that you use the atmosphere, you control the audience's fear.
Director 1: What about action movies?
Ma Kai: It's exactly the same, it's no different. Is this movement you designed advanced? Is it fresh? Or is it very easy to follow the flow? You have to have this aesthetic.
Director 1: Do you have a lot of experience in action movies?
Ma Kai: Many, I'm a huge action fan, I watch almost all action movies. Because when I used to go to high school, I would have felt that I couldn't watch any other movies in the world except action movies, really.
Director 1: But action movies are very volatile now, you have to ask a very experienced martial artist, or like Tom, to have your own core idea, and then a tough team to help realize it.
Ma Kai: To be honest, like Tom is the kind of action played by rich people, I personally actually like "Spy", it is that cool, what is cool? For example, "Spy" is like close-up magic, "Spy" is like large-scale stage magic, which is gorgeous but far from you.
You have to know how to design to be cool, like Takashi Miike's "Hot-Blooded High School", which is also a cool action movie, it can make you burn and make you hi. Those actors he may not know much about movement, he may know what sadness looks like, but he doesn't know what it's like for me to fight cool. At this time, the director needs to tell him what is really cool.
Director 1: But don't you really need a great action director?
Makay: No. In fact, it's like shooting a horror movie, I tell the photographer how to move the lens, for example, the male protagonist is a person with infinite strength, then the feeling he fights is to punch you and hit your head, and then his strength is so strong that your head lands first and your feet. This is the explosive power of the action that I understand, so when the action director designs for me, I have to design in this direction.
Action also needs rhythm and layer, for example, if I want to design a fight scene, ordinary action directors may... Then you will be finished fighting, and after fighting, this drama will be over. But Wong Kar-wai couldn't do it when he filmed "A Generation of Grandmasters", I wanted five different textures of fighting styles. You see, starting with the first Baguazhang, which is the first rhythm. To the second, fighting with the old man, he actually has no movement, Wing Chun listening bridge, is done under a kind of static, which is the second rhythm. The third is Hong Fist and Great Sage Splitting Melon together, until the last level, no more fighting, start to talk about theory...
The action director will give you some design, but whether it's good or not, your director has to help him, in fact, it's like I adjust an actor, he has potential in acting, but you have to inspire it.
First Director: I still have to say that this is a bigger pit than "Night".
Ma Kai: I don't know why I'm so confident, but I just think I can shoot. I will make sufficient preparations in advance, make small samples, if you don't listen to me, I will change immediately. I'm not going to run to the scene and talk to you about this, there's no need.
Director 1: Then you still have to find actors who can play, who are you going to play with?
Ma Kai: As far as the gang of "Zhong Evil" is concerned, that's them.
First Director: !!!
Ma Kai: I'll show you that I can also do action movies. And my future plan is to do magic moves, because I think I have imagination in magic places, but I have to prove that I can make action scenes first, and then people believe it.
Director 1: Another magical action?
Ma Kai: Yes, it's a bit like director Wuershan, who first shoots "Knife Laughter", and then shoots this large-scale magical thing.
03
Industry illusion
For the past seven years, I have survived death, and at one point imagined that every day was the end of the world
First Director: Let's talk a little sensually, from the 2016 FIRST Film Festival, to now, we have known each other for seven years.
Ma Kai: Yes, you know that from the time I stepped into this industry, from 2010 to doing group performances, until the 2016 FIRST Film Festival, this period was a bit like a fantasy journey.
Director 1: Do you have a feeling that after the afterglow of FIRST slowly fades, no one pays attention to me.
Ma Kai: I have, I definitely have the fear of being forgotten by the audience, which is 100%.
Director 1: But actually, you haven't really seen the widest audience before "Night."
Makay: Right. But fortunately, the industry still recognizes me. Generally, the boss of a film company who does a thriller theme may think of me first.
Director 1: When is the hottest?
Ma Kai: It should be from 2016 to the end of 2018, because in 2018, "Zhongxie" was at its highest popularity.
But since 2019, I haven't taken on the show during that period, in fact, I just want to make this type of film I like, and I have also received a lot of planning, but I don't like it much, so I haven't filmed it.
In fact, I have been waiting for "Great Night", and I have always wanted to do this film.
Director 1: This script is earlier than "Zhong Evil", right?
Ma Kai: Earlier, I remember it was at the end of 2012. In fact, the concept is quite mixed, I watched thousands of movies at the time, and I felt that the audience would be interested in what was on the set. After all, 2012 was not as much as there are now self-media, and everyone can see things on the set at any time, and "Night" should be a more attractive theme for the audience at that time, but I purely think that it cannot really be put on the big screen, and I definitely dare not think about it.
But I later had a new understanding of this kind of thriller comedy and decided to start doing it, and it ended up going through a lot of things, and it really hit me very hard, really extremely serious, it can be called escape.
Director 1: Is it so ruthless, how many rounds of blows are there?
Ma Kai: Yes, in fact, we made a version of "Great Night" before, which was played by my brothers in "Zhong Evil", and we have experienced so much together, I hope we can still keep walking, instead of saying "quack" disconnected.
Director 1: Finished shooting, but didn't do post?
Makay: There is no money.
Director 1: So did this shooting cost a lot of money?
Ma Kai: It's quite a lot, but I don't know specifically, I didn't care about the money, and the producer reported a very high number. You think I finished filming "Zhong Evil" in 2015, and I haven't shot anything since, and I wanted to hurry up and get into the next project. Anyway, it was shelved, from 2018 until 2021.
Director 1: What is the main problem?
Ma Kai: The management is quite dissatisfied, and this is what hit me to the point of not being able to do it.
Director 1: What level of dissatisfaction?
Ma Kai: The boss didn't like it, very much. In fact, I am very grateful to the boss, who didn't even read the book at first, so he invested money in me.
To be honest, I don't have this kind of experience in negotiation, you think, suddenly a big capitalist comes to invest in you, from a cost of tens of thousands of dollars, to a relatively large creation, you believed their vision at that time, and felt that they should be right and senior.
But in the end, he didn't recognize you, felt that what you shot was nothing, I completely lost my judgment, I couldn't do it, I felt wasted, completely collapsed, I would no longer believe in what I recognized, and I didn't dare to show it to anyone anymore.
Director 1: Do you feel like you're being PUA?
Ma Kai: No, he doesn't have PUA me, it's just a matter of facts, and he doesn't like it's his personal taste. Just like after the release of "Night", there were also scolding and dislikes on the Internet, maybe this person who didn't like it happened to be my boss.
I didn't complain about him, I still miss his good in this matter, he didn't insist on finishing this film, just his own aesthetic judgment, not deliberately targeting me.
Director 1: How did this happen to you?
Ma Kai: Later I also summarized why it is like this. At that time, I probably felt, first, that I was not strong enough, and second, that I had too little experience in this kind of industrial process.
Director 1: Is there depression when it is the hardest?
Ma Kai: There will be depression, obviously, as soon as there is a psychological problem, my body will immediately react, burst acne, burst a lot of acne. I slept for a short time, groggy every day, cranky, and sometimes I always thought about the end of the world, which destroyed me and didn't want to do it.
Director 1: Did any friends come to help you solve the siege at that point in time?
Makay: No. And this is just the beginning of a series of painful things for me, and there are a lot of things ahead that I didn't expect.
Director 1: What else is there in the future, such as finding a new takeover, how to solve the copyright matter?
MC: Copyright is one of them, it's more complicated than you have to make a new project. In addition, I also see a lot of dark things about humanity.
Director 1: My God, have you been fooled by others during this time?
Ma Kai: Yes, I was deceived by some righteous words, anyway, I encountered a lot of things, otherwise why I haven't made anything in the middle seven years.
Until the end, I contacted another producer of Matt Company through a producer, and he showed their boss, Mr. Chen Lizhi, the first version I had filmed before, and Mr. Chen liked it very much, so he felt very good and helped me solve the siege.
Director 1: After Mr. Chen took over, his mentality became better, right?
Makay: Heavier.
Director 1: Huh?
Ma Kai: The pressure is even greater, because I want to replace the previous brothers.
First Director: Oh, Dong Tianwen, right, did he later play a role in "Night", the cinematographer in Liang Long's crew? He got fat.
Makay: Yes, it's him. I think remaking it is a way to break the siege, otherwise the project will be stuck there, which is not good for anyone.
Director 1: But your brothers can understand it.
Makay: Yes. Sometimes it feels like we're just on a boat, I'm the captain, but the crew really didn't get better because of me, so I thought that if Night went well, I might get more resources and help them in another way.
In fact, I also wrote a new script for them, and after I put it on, I can shoot it, let them star, and at the same time invite some stars to work together and make a slightly larger production.
Director 1: In other words, what about your income over the years, you can't go back to Hengdian and float.
Ma Kai: Actually, fortunately, I signed three plays with a film company, probably in 2019 or 2020, I forgot, anyway, at that time, I signed and got a signing fee.
Director 1: I really don't know this, this is subsistence money.
Makay: Right.
Director 1: Did this company participate in "Night"?
Ma Kai: There is no such film as "Night", because this film was signed before the contract, and it has nothing to do with it.
Director 1: Make three films for them, and that's nearly ten years.
Ma Kai: Probably not, I won't be so abrasive now, I'll shoot it later, and suffocate me.
Director 1: What about the specifics?
Ma Kai: It's very simple, I first ask them if they want to do the project, they can do it if they want, if they don't want to do it, I can also go to other companies.
Director 1: That's fine, I thought I was selling the deed.
Ma Kay: Yes, it's not that kind of death contract, the owner of this company is very good to me.
*The pictures in the article are provided by interviewees, some sources are from the Internet, if you have any questions, please contact this number.