The former richest man and the alternative Wahaha: insisted that the company did not go into debt, did not issue bonds, and never had a loan

The following article is from China Entrepreneur Magazine and is written by Xie Yunzi

Where a person comes from determines where he goes.

Author: Xie Yunzi Editor: Xu Tan

Source: China Entrepreneur Magazine (ID: iceo-com-cn)

Entrepreneur's note: Comrade Zong Qinghou, founder and chairman of Wahaha Group, passed away at 10:30 on February 25, 2024 at the age of 79 due to ineffective medical treatment.

On February 25, Wahaha's official Weibo released "Obituary":

Member of the Communist Party of China, National Model Worker, Winner of the National May Day Labor Medal, Outstanding Builder of Socialism with Chinese Characteristics, 100 Outstanding Private Entrepreneurs in the 40 Years of Reform and Opening-up, Deputy to the 10th, 11th and 12th National People's Congress, Representative of the 12th, 13th and 14th Congress of the Communist Party of China in Zhejiang Province, Founder and Chairman of Wahaha Group, Comrade Zong Qinghou, died at 10:30 on February 25, 2024 at the age of 79 due to ineffective medical treatment.

The funeral committee of Comrade Zong Qinghou of Hangzhou Wahaha Group Co., Ltd. is scheduled to hold a memorial service at 10 a.m. on February 28, 2024 at the Xiasha base of Hangzhou Wahaha Group Co., Ltd. (the intersection of No. 10 Street and No. 5 Street, Baiyang Street, Qiantang District, Hangzhou).

Where a person comes from determines where he goes.

The headquarters of Wahaha Group at No. 160 Qingtai Street in Hangzhou is a gray and somewhat dilapidated six-story building, even though Wahaha Group has been scattered in various production bases, Zong Qinghou also insists on coming to No. 160 Qingtai Street every day to "work". This is also the location of the school-run factory when Zong Qinghou first started his business, and he has never left the starting point of his business.

On Labor Day in 1987, Zong Qinghou personally hung the sign of "Hangzhou Shangcheng District School-run Enterprise Distribution Department" here, perhaps Zong Qinghou did not think at that time, he stepped on a tricycle to send school books and stationery, and actually sent an empire with annual sales of tens of billions.

In the modern business world, which is accustomed to using various financial means, Wahaha is an alternative. Over the past 31 years, Wahaha has had an unbelievable tradition of insisting that the company is not in debt, has not issued any bonds, and has never had a penny of bank loans. Over the years, Wahaha has grown organically by relying entirely on its own funds.

Pan Jiajie, director of Wahaha's material supply department, told China Entrepreneur, "In the eyes of many financiers, this approach is not smart, if Wahaha is a financial company, it will make at least hundreds of millions of profits a year." But Wahaha will not break the balance with dealers and agents because of these hundreds of millions. Wahaha has annual sales of tens of billions of yuan, but at the end of the year, there are almost no accounts receivable and accounts payable, and there is no capital holding cost. ”

Wahaha's "conservative" may have shown a little advantage in 2018, with financial deleveraging that began in 2017 and was implemented on a large scale in 2018. Wahaha was less affected.

But at the same time, Wahaha, which has reached the age of its establishment, is facing a situation that is far more complicated than when Zong Qinghou started his business. For example, to be listed or not to be listed, where is the next growth point?

In November 2017, at Wahaha's 30th anniversary celebration, Zong Qinghou changed his previous attitude of "never going public" and publicly stated that "after listing, the development of the enterprise can be accelerated, and it will be considered at the appropriate time". You must know that the function of listing is financing, which is a bit contradictory to the previous caliber of "not bad money".

At the end of August, Zong Qinghou said in an exclusive interview with "Chinese Entrepreneur": "Wahaha does not have a definite listing plan at present, we are not short of money now, and if there are projects that require large capital investment in the future, we will also consider listing." However, if it is listed, it must be responsible for shareholders, and it is not good for shareholders to not receive dividends if they only raise money but do not increase the efficiency of the enterprise. ”

In March 2018, it was revealed by the media that Wahaha liquidated its employees' shares at a price of 2.6 yuan per share. This move was interpreted more by the outside world as Wahaha paving the way for the subsequent listing. The new company law stipulates that when a company to be listed applies to the CSRC for listing, the number of shareholders shall not exceed 200, and Wahaha has been exposed to have 15,000 shareholders, which may become a major obstacle to its listing.

In response to this news, Wahaha made an official reply to "Chinese Entrepreneur".

"Although the company adjusts the shareholding quota according to the performance of employees every year, the overall trend is that it only rises but does not fall, so there will be a large difference in the shareholding quota of the same position due to the length of working years, bringing a new 'big pot rice' phenomenon. Therefore, in order to better motivate employees, Wahaha has recovered all the shares held by employees at a high price, and at the same time, the total annual dividends remain unchanged, and they will be re-evaluated according to their positions and performance as dry shares. ”

Once upon a time, Wahaha was the potential king of market capitalization. In 2013, Zong Qinghou was named the richest man on Forbes' 2013 Chinese Rich List with a net worth of $11.6 billion, and in the same year, Wahaha set a record of 78.3 billion yuan in revenue. However, after 2015, Wahaha's sales entered a downward channel, decreasing at a rate of 20% every year. In 2017, Wahaha's revenue was only 46.4 billion yuan. Wahaha's challenges are more severe than ever.

To see a person's future is to go back to his past.

Zong Qinghou is the eldest son of the family, in order to reduce the burden of the family, after graduating from junior high school, he went to the countryside to the Mamu Farm in Zhoushan, and a few years later transferred to the Shaoxing Tea Farm, where he stayed in the countryside for 15 years. After returning to Hangzhou, Zong Qinghou took his mother's place and worked as a salesman in a primary school factory. Perhaps in order to make up for the wasted youth, in 1987, Zong Qinghou started his own business.

In 1989, Zong Qinghou established Hangzhou Wahaha Nutritional Food Factory and successfully launched the first product - children's nutrition solution. The children's nutrition solution was popular in the market as soon as it was launched. In 1991, Wahaha acquired the insolvent Hangzhou Canning Factory, and the merger of the Hangzhou Canning Factory prompted Wahaha to move towards scale, and by mistake became the first shot of reform and opening up.

In 1994, Wahaha ushered in another important node, in order to solve the problems of bad debts and triangular debts, Zong Qinghou launched the joint sales system. In the eyes of the vast majority of people, the joint sales system laid the foundation for Wahaha's huge marketing network since then.

Wahaha is a marketing-driven enterprise, and in this field, Zong Qinghou has been worshiped as a god-like marketing genius by Wahaha employees.

"For sales, Mr. Zong has the most simple theory, everything is to solve the problem of buying and selling," Shen Jiangang, general manager of Wahaha Sales Company, told China Entrepreneur magazine, "Mr. Zong believes that if you want others to help you sell products, in addition to signing a contract with him, you must also have interests, so how to tie the interests between manufacturers and suppliers is particularly important." In other words, the essence of the joint sales body is to solve the relationship between the manufacturer and the supplier. ”

Under this premise, Wahaha has signed joint sales agreements with nearly 8,000 distributors, and it only takes a week for a new product to appear in stores in remote mountain villages. From the very beginning, Wahaha has set its sights on the rural market, and it can be said that Wahaha's growth is very Chinese. In the 15 years in the countryside, Zong Qinghou has become familiar with the "Selected Works of Mao Zedong".

Xiao Zhuqing, general manager of Shandong Wenwen Liquor Group, joined Wahaha Group in 2000. According to Xiao Zhuqing, Wahaha has never believed in CCTV's ratings research company.

Zong Qinghou said that the samples of the CCTV survey company were all residents of the city, and Wahaha only put CCTV and provincial satellite TV, which were the only two channels that could be seen in the countryside back then. At this time, Wahaha has a very simple development strategy - "push and pull collection", that is, through satellite TV pulling, joint sales body pushing.

"I was in charge of the promotion of 'Seven Cups of Tea', and at that time we worked with Stephen Chow to help select actors for his new film online and offline in seven cities across the country. At that time, there was no Hunan Satellite TV's "Super Girl", which is different from people's perception of the aging of the Wahaha brand at this stage, Wahaha is actually the originator of the draft. ”

In addition to the joint draft with Stephen Chow, Wahaha's most successful promotion case is the signing of Leehom Wang. It is understood that Leehom Wang's endorsement fee was very low back then, and he never took the initiative to ask for a price increase. Wahaha was a big customer of CCTV at that time, and Wang Leehom used the power of Wahaha to go to the Spring Festival Gala, hold concerts, and shoot MVs. At that time, Wahaha's offline layout was very dense, and pure water could sell 2 billion bottles a year, and each bottle had Leehom Wang's avatar. ”

In addition, another feature of Wahaha is its follow-up strategy, the most famous of which is the imitation of Coca-Cola.

In 1998, Wahaha launched Very Coke, mainly for the rural market. According to Xiao Zhuqing's recollection, at that time, dealers could earn two yuan more than Coca-Cola for every box of Very Coke sold, and Coca-Cola and Pepsi Cola were packaged in plastic, while Very Coke used big red boxes for outer packaging, and advertisements mainly spread festive culture to meet the needs of farmers for gifts. However, after the popularization of cable TV, Wahaha's old playing method no longer worked.

In the eyes of more people, the root cause of Wahaha's declining sales is that consumer needs have changed. An industry insider, who did not want to be named, told reporters, "It can't be said that Wahaha did anything wrong, mainly because the sky has changed." In the past, consumers believed in advertising, but now consumers are very rational, and the development of cold chain logistics has also made dairy products with a shorter shelf life become the mainstream of the market. ”

In addition, the channels of the beverage market are also changing. Nowadays, there are three main types of retail terminals: one is Carrefour, Wal-Mart and other international stores, the second is the standard supermarket such as C.P. Lotus and Supermarket, and the third is the chain convenience store such as full-time and good neighbor. And these new channels require strong control and marketing support.

An industry insider told reporters: "Compared with Coca-Cola and Master Kong, Wahaha's joint sales body is asset-light, and with the upgrading of consumption, the 'asset-heavy' advantage of Coca-Cola and Master Kong's retail channels is becoming more and more obvious." ”

It is understood that Coca-Cola is directly operated globally, and considering the complexity of the Chinese market, it also distributes in some non-key cities, but the proportion is negligible. Master Kong is a typical "grasp the big and let go of the small", with direct sales in key cities and key customers, and half of the channel agent distribution.

More people believe that although the asset-heavy model has a large initial investment, after a certain period of time, the control advantages of brand manufacturers over retail terminals are highlighted. For new channels, the management of "freezing", "vividness" and "refinement" is very important, and these needs can only be met by directly operated institutions.

The first is freezing, in order to ensure the taste of the drink, brand manufacturers need to put freezers on offline terminals. Xiao Zhuqing told the reporter of "Chinese Entrepreneur": "In Hubei Province alone, Nongfu Spring has put 180,000 freezers, and Master Kong has put 220,000 units, of course, this freezer is only allowed to display the products of brand owners." ”

In addition, for offline retail stores, brand owners also need to do refined and "vivid" management. It is understood that for key customers, Nongfu Spring has three batches of salesmen who provide services respectively for "running orders and delivery, sorting out displays, and event promotions". "Vividness" is a concept invented by Coca-Cola, that is, Coca-Cola has an exhibition point as far as consumers can see.

So what is the biggest drawback of the joint sales system? A person close to Wahaha told "Chinese Entrepreneur" that it is precisely because of the binding of interests with manufacturers that the performance of Wahaha dealers is under great pressure. In recent years, Wahaha has also increased its own directly-operated institutions, but the proportion is very low, which is also the reason why Wahaha's channel power in big cities is getting smaller and smaller.

Another key to the smooth implementation of the joint sales body is to be able to control the balance between manufacturers and distributors, which requires that the product has enough price difference to meet the needs of both parties. The key to the price spread is the ability to produce high gross margin products, which can be a challenge for the industry as a whole.

It is understood that Nongfu Spring CEO Zhong Sui once asked Nongfu Spring to reduce the price, and the price of each box is two yuan more expensive than Wahaha. But even so, it still can't meet the needs of dealers. "Labor costs, supermarkets, wholesale rents are more expensive, two yuan can no longer support the supplier's expectations for the price difference. ”

For a long time, Wahaha has pursued to be a high-quality and low-cost brand.

"Wahaha is already the best in terms of packaging cost control, and there is a joke that the cost of fake water made by small manufacturers will not be cheaper than Wahaha. It can be said that bottled water is the promotion of Wahaha in China. The above-mentioned person told reporters that this of course also means that Wahaha is more urgent than other brands to develop new products that can increase prices.

What is certain is that Wahaha is still the overlord of Chinese beverages, and Zong Qinghou is still the entrepreneur who understands the attributes of China's channels best.

Third- and fourth-tier cities and rural markets can bring abundant benefits to enterprises, while high-margin products are targeted at first- and second-tier markets. However, if Wahaha cannot upgrade its channels and management system at the same time, it will always be only "surrounded" and cannot be conquered in the first- and second-tier markets. Any product has a life cycle, and product upgrading is the key to solving the aging of the brand matrix, and Zong Qinghou has undoubtedly realized this.

Wahaha's latest trend is to re-enter the big health market, and will launch products such as "meal replacement powder" and "probiotics" for adults. At the same time, Zong Qinghou is trying to make a social retail platform.

As early as before, Wahaha has made many attempts to diversify, but business itself is the accumulation of trial and error, no matter what the market response is, Zong Qinghou and Wahaha have never stopped.

With the transfer of the Internet to offline, Alibaba's retail channel and JD.com's new channel are also head-to-head with offline channels.

In the eyes of more people, Wahaha still only has Zong Qinghou. In a TV interview many years ago, Zong Qinghou's daughter Zong Fuli was asked, "What is Wahaha minus Zong Qinghou?" ”

In Shen Jiangang's words, Zong Qinghou is the kind of boss who is both feared and respected, and although he is stern but hateful, no matter how complicated the matter, he can peel back the cocoon and find out the key to the problem. "He never uses WeChat or the Internet, and once gave us an analysis of the essence of new retail, and he drew a picture to analyze it. ”

To this day, Zong Qinghou, who has been fighting for more than 30 years, still travels often and insists on working every day. However, in the past two years, Zong Qinghou has also realized the importance of delegating power. Wahaha wants to "Zong Qinghou", which is the inevitable development, Zong Qinghou himself admits that Wahaha's big company is more seriously ill in the year of its establishment.

"They all said that I was more dictatorial, in the past I was really too detailed, causing employees to rely on me, now I am gradually changing the management method, but also in the process transformation, over the years Wahaha is also cultivating the middle level of management. Zong Qinghou told "Chinese Entrepreneur".

In Zong Qinghou's personal biography "The Principle of Gravitation", Chi Universe said that Zong Qinghou was a "moderate hawk". On the occasion of the 40th anniversary of reform and opening up, in an era when consumption and channels have entered an era of sudden changes, can Zong Qinghou carry out a gentle change within Wahaha?

The following is an exclusive interview with Zong Qinghou, chairman of Wahaha Group, by a reporter from "China Entrepreneur":

CE: You started your business at the age of 42, Ren Zhengfei started your business at the age of 43, and Liu Chuanzhi started your business at the age of 40. By the standards of today's investors, 40 years old has passed the golden age of entrepreneurship. Where does your passion come from and what is the entrepreneurial environment like?

Zong Qinghou: Before the reform and opening up, we were engaged in a planned economy, and the common people of the whole country were all proletarians, and everyone ate egalitarian big pot rice, doing more and doing less, doing good and bad work, so they did not have the enthusiasm to create wealth. After the reform and opening up, there were entrepreneurial opportunities, so we were already middle-aged when we started our business. In December 1978, the Third Plenary Session of the CPC Central Committee proposed to shift the focus of the party's work to economic construction and carry out reform and opening up.

In the winter of 1978, I returned to Hangzhou from the Shaoxing Tea Farm. At that time, the reform of the land contract system was also carried out in the rural areas, the material conditions were gradually enriched, and all kinds of "tickets" were abolished. The city also implemented the factory director contracting responsibility system, and more and more people began to start their own businesses, but due to the social environment at that time, there were still many private start-up enterprises with the brand of "collective" or "national". Later, the State Council and the National People's Congress again enacted laws stipulating that whoever invests owns equity, so that more and more "red hat" private enterprises have been transformed from "state-owned enterprises" to private enterprises.

I was born in 1945, and after the victory of the Anti-Japanese War in August 1945, my generation was educated by the Communist Party, so the original intention of starting a business was simply to do something. At the beginning, the money earned was not all their own, and the company had to hand over 40% of the profits under the name of national ownership, and I think the same was true for many entrepreneurs who started their own businesses at that time, including Mr. Liu Chuanzhi of Lenovo.

CE: In 1988, the sales of Wahaha's self-developed children's nutrition solution exceeded 100 million yuan, and the company completed the original capital accumulation. Has this laid the foundation for Wahaha's corporate strategy driven by fist products, brand power and strong channels in the later stage?

Zong Qinghou: Children's nutrition solution is our first product, and we have also won the first pot of gold. Wahaha started from scratch, and used to do consignment sales and small business, and it was really difficult to start a business when you first started, and others looked down on you, but I think many start-ups were like this at the beginning.

Wahaha was originally affiliated with a school-run enterprise, so we have a better understanding of the school's situation. At that time, I saw that many children were yellow and thin, and at that time the one-child policy was introduced, and there was only one child in a family, and the pampering of parents caused problems such as partial eating and malnutrition. At that time, there were many kinds of health products on the market, but none of them were aimed at children's picky eating and anorexia, so we felt that there was a great business opportunity here, so we decided to develop appetizing products for children. We found experts from the Department of Nutrition of Zhejiang Medical University at that time to help us develop an all-natural formula, and Yu Ruomu, then president of the Chinese Nutrition Society and the wife of Comrade Chen Yun, also helped us a lot.

In 1991, Wahaha decided to expand production and needed to build a factory, but we are not a planned economy unit, and the volume is also very small, so the land use index has not been approved. And even if it is approved, it will take a long time to build a factory and buy equipment, and it will take a long time to pull up the production line to form a production capacity, which will not solve our imminent capacity gap at all. Just when we were at a loss, the secretary general of the Hangzhou Municipal Party Committee came to talk to me, hoping that Wahaha could merge the Hangzhou Canned Food Factory. Hangzhou Canned Food Factory was the largest food enterprise in the country at that time, and its products were mainly exported, but due to special historical reasons at that time, the export was blocked all of a sudden, and the products could not be sold and became insolvent.

At that time, the Hangzhou tank factory had more than 100 acres of land, more than 60,000 square meters of ready-made factory buildings and more than 2,000 employees, and the merger plan proposed by the government did not require us to spend money, only four or five hundred workers were accepted. But it was soon opposed by many people, and the employees of the Hangzhou Can Factory believed that a large state-owned factory was merged by a small factory and lost face, while the employees of Wahaha were worried that they would be dragged down by the Hangzhou Can Factory and reduce their welfare. Due to too much resistance, the city government sent a working group to the Hangzhou Tank Factory, but it was not done for a long time, and finally the government asked me to go over and talk to the cadres and employees of the Hangzhou Tank Factory, and I mainly talked about three issues at that time:

The first is the question of who is big and who is small. Although there are a large number of people in Hangzhou Can Factory, there are no good products and no good sales, and they are heavily indebted, weak in capacity and small in the market. Although Wahaha is a small factory, its products sell well, the economic benefits are very good, and the market is strong. Therefore, from this point of view, Wahaha is not smaller than Hangzhou Can Factory, and even larger than it.

The second is that after the merger, the income of all employees will increase. At that time, Wahaha employees were given a bonus of 70~80 yuan per month, while the monthly income of Hangzhou Can Factory employees was only about 30 yuan. As long as I am willing to work hard, I promise to treat both employees equally.

The third is to ensure that the original cadres of the Hangzhou Can Factory will not change their positions after the merger, and of course, those who perform well will be promoted, and those who perform poorly will be laid off. After hearing these three articles, everyone was very happy, and they all applauded and passed Wahaha's decision to merge Hangzhou Tank Factory.

CE: In 1991~1992, there was a lot of discussion in public opinion about "surname capital, surname society", and some private entrepreneurs were ready to hand over their assets to the state. Have these controversies affected your faith?

Zong Qinghou: At the time of the annexation in 1991, Comrade Xiaoping had not yet made a speech on his southern tour, and the reform of enterprises in the cities had not yet been carried out in earnest, and the thinking in society was indeed rather rigid. Therefore, at that time, many people said that we were dismantling the state-owned economy and restoring capitalism, but we still had to resolutely carry it out, and it was also affirmed by the main leaders of the provinces and cities at that time, and mainstream media such as "Liberation Daily" also issued articles expressing support. It can be said that our merger with Hangzhou Can Factory has fired the first shot of the reform and opening up of urban enterprises. Of course, during this process, the relevant government leaders also talked to me, and they felt very pressured due to various public opinions.

Later, I also said very simply, we don't want to merge for free, just spend money on merger according to the value of assets, and finally we spent more than 80 million yuan to take over all the assets and liabilities of Hangzhou Can Factory, and all the current and retired employees also took over. Although the cost is relatively large, but only three months later, we let the Hangzhou tank factory turn losses into profits, that year there was a profit of 22 million, the second year reached more than 70 million, it can be said that the merger of Hangzhou tank factory is a key node for Wahaha to achieve large-scale operation.

CE: After 1997, Wahaha has been developing steadily, but the "Dawa Controversy" has been a sensation. Now it seems that the "Dawa Dispute" is a relatively big lesson for you, does it make you understand the rules of the game of capital?

Zong Qinghou: Wahaha originally hoped to develop faster and better, so it asked Danone to invest. At the beginning of the cooperation, we mainly insisted on four points when negotiating: the first is that the management right should belong to us, the second is to use the trademark of "Wahaha" itself, the third is whether Danda can dismiss employees at will, and the fourth is to assume the social responsibility of retired employees.

At that time, we really didn't understand the operation of capital, and now we really suffer a loss. First of all, our joint venture with Danone calculates Wahaha's net assets, while general corporate joint ventures calculate the price-earnings ratio, so Danone has picked up a big bargain. At that time, Peregrine in Hong Kong brought Danone to talk about cooperation, so we always thought that it was a joint venture between three companies, and the two of them sometimes disagreed, so at that time, Danone and Peregrine accounted for a total of 51% of the shares, and Wahaha was 49%, so I think we were relatively the largest shareholder, so we also agreed. However, when the contract was signed, it was only learned that Peregrine and Danone had set up an investment company in Singapore, and the investment company would invest in the Wahaha joint venture. Not long after, due to the Asian financial crisis, Peregrine went bankrupt and resold the shares of the Singapore company to Danone, which became the largest shareholder of the Wahaha joint venture.

Because the benefits are increasing year by year, we have a good relationship with Danone at the beginning. However, because Danone does not understand the Chinese market and does not feel at ease to let us operate, it has set up a lot of obstacles, and does not agree to our request to set up a new factory to increase production capacity, but asks us to find a contract factory, on the other hand, it itself has invested heavily in and even controlled Wahaha's main competitors such as Robust and Guangming. Since the OEM factories that meet our output and quality requirements cannot be found at all, in order to keep the market, our cadres and employees have raised funds to build a number of factories to process products for the joint venture company, and also share the sales costs.

These are all disclosed under the nose of Danone's chief financial officer, and these non-joint venture companies are clearly listed in the annual audit memorandum issued to Danone by Danone's appointed accounting firm, and Danone has never raised any objections. However, due to the continuous losses of companies such as Robust invested by Danone, in order to improve their own performance, the management of Danone Asia Pacific began to use the brains of Wahaha's non-joint ventures, saying that our non-joint venture companies infringed on the interests of joint ventures and demanded to acquire these non-joint ventures at a low price, which of course we resolutely refused.

Danone eventually filed arbitrations and lawsuits against us in many countries around the world. After receiving the litigation materials, we were nervous at first, because we had never fought an international lawsuit, and then I thought that there was nothing to be afraid of when you were justified in traveling all over the world. The most important thing is to sort out two questions: who is engaged in intra-industry competition? Who is abusing trademarks? I think we have done nothing wrong in these two points, and it is precisely because of these two issues that Wahaha has won both domestic and foreign lawsuits.

Through this incident, I also understood two truths. First of all, enterprise cooperation should complement each other's advantages and be honest. Second, we must also dare to go head-to-head. In the past, Chinese companies were very afraid of going to foreign countries to file lawsuits, and we didn't know the language and the law well, but I think it makes sense to appeal.

CE: For a long time, the joint sales body has been regarded by Wahaha as the core competitiveness of the enterprise, how did Wahaha establish the joint sales body and offline supply network?

Zong Qinghou: Wahaha was the first to use the country's sales network, first-level stations, second-level stations, county companies, fourth-level wholesale to terminal retail. Later, when the nutrient solution was launched, we began to use the three channels of sugar, tobacco and liquor companies, non-staple food companies, and pharmaceutical and health product companies. Sugar and liquor companies control retail stores in cities, non-staple food companies control rural supply and marketing cooperatives, and medical and health care companies sell health products. After the reform and opening up, a large number of wholesale farmers' markets appeared, and the state-run network was impacted, so we entered the wholesale farmers' markets. Later, due to the increase in the market, due to competition and bargaining, Wahaha's sales were also affected, and we began to establish our own dealer network.

It can be said that Wahaha is constantly changing its marketing model with market changes. In 1994, most of China's business forms were to ship first and settle later, which caused a lot of bad debts and triangular debts. We were determined to change this situation, and under pressure we began to implement the joint sales system, requiring dealers to "pay on delivery".

Wahaha stipulates that at the end of each year, first-level dealers must pay 10% of the annual sales quota as a deposit to the Wahaha account, for which Wahaha pays interest higher than the bank deposit. In the course of operation, the dealer must settle the payment before purchasing the goods every month. In addition, Wahaha has also developed a strict price difference system. The corresponding dealers of the provincial division company are uniformly divided into first-level wholesale, second-level wholesale, and third-level wholesale, and each level must strictly implement the corresponding sales price, strictly limit the sales within their own sales area, and strictly prohibit the sale of Wahaha products to the market outside the region. Wahaha's products are very popular and the funds are very sufficient, we have united thousands of dealers in the market, and changed from fighting alone to joint competition, and our competitiveness is higher than others.

CE: The foundation of the joint sales body is the fist product and strong brand value, so is it only by working the brand and products can we maintain the long-term balance between the joint sales body and Wahaha?

Zong Qinghou: Yes, the most important thing for the joint marketing body is to maintain balance. Wahaha is Party A, the distributor is Party B, and only with fist products and strong brand power can the relationship between the two sides be maintained, which requires Wahaha to have more best-selling products.

CE: Data shows that Wahaha had a business performance of 78.3 billion yuan in 2013, and by 2017, Wahaha's revenue was only 46.4 billion yuan. Among them, the sales of Nutrition Express fell the most, what do you think is the reason for this?

Zong Qinghou: The damage is mainly caused by online rumors. The melamine scandal has spilled over into the food and beverage industry. In fact, in 2014, our decline was not large, but since 2015, there have been rumors on the Internet attacking Nutrition Express and Shuang Crooked, and it has been said that consumers will get leukemia, hypochondrosis, and botulinum toxin when they drink it. At that time, the management of the Internet was also relatively chaotic, and rumors could not be effectively stopped, and our annual sales decline increased significantly in those years.

We started with the District Public Security Bureau, reported to the Municipal and Provincial Public Security Bureaus, and finally reported to the Ministry of Public Security and did not file a case. However, since 2018, Wahaha's overall sales have resumed growth, but the growth rate is not fast enough. I hope that in 2019, Wahaha will return to the sales level of 2012 and return to 70 billion sales.

CE: It is said that Wahaha's channel network is measured by your feet, and Wahaha is also a marketing-driven enterprise, in your opinion, what is the essence of marketing?

Zong Qinghou: The essence of marketing is to solve the problem of "who buys and who sells". "Who will buy" is to find out the real needs of consumers. For example, children's nutrition solution is to solve the problem of children not wanting to eat, and nutrition express is to solve the problem of young people not eating breakfast.

"Who sells" refers to how quickly the product is developed and pushed to the consumer through the sales channel, and how to promote it in the process. In the past two years, the marketing environment is also changing, and now consumers do not watch TV or newspapers, and the traditional media publicity effect is much worse than before.

CE: We have also noticed that Wahaha is doing social retail, how do you understand this model?

Zong Qinghou: I hope Wahaha can work with real economy enterprises to build a platform, where consumers can become our members by scanning the QR code and buy our products at a preferential price, and they are also delivered to their homes. I hope to bring real benefits to consumers, so that the real economy will not be disrupted, and there will be its own channels and sales. Of course, social retail is just a new model, and we're still experimenting with it.

CE: Now e-commerce giants such as Alibaba and JD.com are moving offline, and new channels and retail channels are extending their tentacles to the rural market, and these areas were originally Wahaha's channel advantages accumulated over the years. What do you think about the head-to-head battle with the internet?

Zong Qinghou: I am not against the Internet, e-commerce is a new sales model, which can bring more convenience to consumers, especially in rural markets, e-commerce can help farmers sell products online, which is very good.

In fact, what I have always opposed is that the Internet burns money to buy traffic on a large scale, sells the hard-earned fruits of the real economy, and disrupts the market price of the real economy. In fact, the real economy has been more difficult in the past two years, but what enterprises need to face is nothing more than how to upgrade products to meet the increasing needs of consumers.

Traditional brick-and-mortar enterprises are different from Internet companies, which solve the problem of people's clothing, food, housing and transportation, and truly create wealth. If everyone goes into the business of "making money out of money", I think this society will not be able to survive in the end.

CE: Hangzhou has produced three richest people in China, in addition to you, there are also Alibaba's Ma Yun and NetEase's Ding Lei, do you usually have an intersection with each other?

Zong Qinghou: There are indeed many outstanding entrepreneurs among Zhejiang businessmen, who have made good achievements in their respective fields, which is something that we are very proud of. As for the title of "richest man", I think it is more just a symbol, a representative of the Zhejiang business group. Mr. Ma Yun and Ding Lei and I, because we are in different industries, and we are usually very busy, I don't like to socialize too much, so I really don't have many contacts.

CE: You have insisted that Wahaha will not be listed, why did you mention the listing plan recently?

Zong Qinghou: Actually, we don't have a clear plan to go public, some time ago a reporter asked me why I didn't go public, and I replied that if there is a need and a big project to invest, I will consider going public. In the process of development, there will be choices for an enterprise, and I think that as a business, the stall should not be too big. Regarding listing, we are not short of money now, and if there are projects that require large capital investment in the future, we can also consider listing. However, if it is listed, it is necessary to be responsible for shareholders, only raising money but not increasing the efficiency of the enterprise, and it is too bad for shareholders not to share dividends.

CE: Was there a time when Wahaha's Food City was launched in 1997?

Zong Qinghou: At that time, the country had just started to do the stock market, and we were a pilot unit in Zhejiang Province, so the public offering set up a food city, but the public offering required the approval of the China Securities Regulatory Commission. In fact, at that time, including the government, they did not understand the concept of listing, and the CSRC finally rejected the listing application of this project, and the food city was not successfully listed.

CE: Wahaha has always maintained a large balance of funds, insisted on not borrowing, did not have a penny of bank loans, and never issued any bonds, and has completely relied on its own funds for endogenous growth over the years. It's surprising, why do you do that?

Zong Qinghou: Our corporate benefits for so many years are also very good, the original accumulation is abundant, and we have been following the business idea of "small steps and fast running", not doing things beyond our strength, and not blindly expanding and developing. Therefore, Wahaha is not short of money, and of course there is no need to borrow money if there is no shortage of money. Before the product is sold, Wahaha collects the money first, and our packaging material costs in 2018 are settled at the end of each month, and they are paid directly with the payment, so they do not need to occupy too much cash.

CE: What are your plans for Wahaha's future, and what kind of big projects will be implemented?

Zong Qinghou: Wahaha will insist on developing its main business, and the concept of its products will shift from "safety" to "health". Nowadays, many young people have sub-health problems, and there are more and more diseases of wealth, so we hope to develop some health care products through the concept of TCM diet therapy and bioengineering technology. Wahaha has developed solid probiotic drinks, meal replacement powders, goat milk powders, etc. for adults. At the same time, Wahaha is also looking for opportunities to enter the high-tech industry, but we are very cautious and must fully consider it, and cannot drag down the main business.

CE: Wahaha is 31 years old, have you encountered any problems in corporate governance? What is your management philosophy?

Zong Qinghou: They all said that I was more dictatorial, and when the Hangzhou Can Factory was merged, there were mountains and systems, but they were all gone.

In fact, the Chinese are more difficult to manage, and Mao Zedong is "monopolizing power and decentralizing small power" in management. Wahaha is also a highly centralized management model, Wahaha has more than 80 independent accounting production bases, but the entire sales, supply chain, and finance are centralized, and the subsidiaries manage production and pay attention to product quality. This kind of centralization has two advantages, first, that your strategy can be implemented efficiently, and second, that there is unity of thought.

But leaders still need to be open-minded and let everyone speak out about innovative ideas.

Chinese say that thirty is standing, but Wahaha is now a big business with a more serious disease. We are also carrying out process transformation, the implementation of the post responsibility system, hierarchical authorization, these years Wahaha has also been cultivating the middle level of management, in the past I was too detailed, resulting in the dependence of employees on me, and now I am gradually changing my management style.

CE: There are generally two models of family business succession, the heir is both the largest shareholder and the manager of the company, or the professional manager manages the company, and the heir is only the representative of the major shareholder. Which kind of Wahaha will be in the future?

Zong Qinghou: In China, the class of professional managers has not yet been formed, but it will get better and better in the future. The second generation of private enterprises is not necessarily all successors, many of them are returnees and are unwilling to take over. My daughter now manages 1/3 of Wahaha's business, but she still likes to do something new. She is now also our Head of Brand PR, which is also responsible for the packaging and design of the products, as well as KellyOne Juice. She has her own company, and I support her to try it out, and I won't interfere with her.

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