"Snow Cloud" is the first feature film directed by Wu Lang, and the short film of the same name was shortlisted for the short film competition at the Cannes Film Festival last year. This year, "Snow Cloud" was shortlisted for the Berlin Film Festival's Adventure Unit, becoming the only Chinese-language film shortlisted for the unit since its inception. For director Wu Lang, the Berlin Film Festival is like a flame, not only an inspiration for his personal persistence to have an echo; It is also a support for team creation, making them believe more that serious creation and insistence that their creative expression has a chance to be seen. And for the starring Li Meng, excitement and excitement are obviously the most intuitive emotions. They immediately shared it with the other two leading actors, Li Kangsheng and Renke, and agreed to drink until dawn in Berlin.
The main creator of "Snow Cloud" at the Berlin Film Festival
"Snow Cloud" tells the story of Han Jiangyu (played by Li Kangsheng), who has been away from his hometown for ten years, returning to his hometown and trying to regain his old love with his former lover Su Hong (played by Li Meng). Han Jiangyu's former friend Chen Kai (played by Renke) participated in the house purchase plan, so that Han Jiangyu and Su Hong had to face their own problems and face the difficulties of life together. In addition to the story, "Snow Cloud" is more like a slowly unfolding picture scroll, and Wu Lang's unique image style makes every frame of this film poetic. Emotions and beauty blend to immerse people in the world of "Snow Clouds".
The film premiered at the Berlin Film Festival the day before yesterday, and we chatted with director Wu Lang, starring Li Meng, and producer Don He about the story behind "Snow Clouds" before that. Everyone unanimously avoided the "difficulty" in film creation, and turned to talk about the real creative power in the film. Enthusiasm is hard to hide, and in the end, it is still the pure sincerity of creation that reaches people's hearts.
01
Wu Lang
The motivation to create
Just "because"
What inspired Snow Cloud in the first place?
Wu Lang: You imagine a scene where we are on a ferry, and this ferry boat is going from land to a small island, and there are some villagers and some tourists on board, making noise on deck. The boatman stared at the sea like a torch, the boat sailed on the sea, but a gust of wind suddenly blew over, maybe the tourist's hat blew into the air, at this time your eyes were led to the bridge being built in the distance, when the boat approached the bridge you found that the piers were hundreds of meters high, and the ferry boat was like a lone boat that was particularly small. This spatial contrast touched me very much, and at the same time made me start thinking about what already exists and what is about to disappear. When the bridge under construction is fully open to traffic, the ferry boat we are on will no longer exist, and the route will be completely removed.
This struck me a little, and when I went to the island, I found that the roads were being widened, there was a sound of machinery everywhere, and the process of urbanization was very rapid to bring the island into the current process. So you will find that even if it feels like it is still in this moment, there will be a foresight that what has existed and disappeared is not in the same time and space, and these are sources of inspiration and opportunities.
How long was the script of "Snow Cloud" early to create? How long was the shooting?
Wu Lang: The script of "Snow Cloud" has been adjusted. From the end of 2016 to 2017, it began to develop, and in 2019, our script went to the venture capital unit of the Shanghai Film Festival, and this script was also encouraged by director Wong Kar-wai, who is very looking forward to this script being made into a movie, and this support gives us great creative confidence. Until Christmas Eve 2021, our story has been changing. Because I have a creative habit myself, I will repeatedly go to the scene to be filmed to survey and rescape, the scene is constantly changing, some are transformed, some may be vacated, occupied, widened, and the structure of the story will continue to change in the process of this change, so this is a continuous process.
The filming took about 31 days.
I was deeply touched by the beauty conveyed by the film, and I was more curious about what parts of the overall creation made your heart surging?
Wu Lang: You said that there is a scene that is still unfinished, can you share what it is?
The scene where Su Hong wore an orange-red dress and Han Jiangyu walked back and forth in the alley. Without any words, but captivated by the tension they pulled at each other.
Wu Lang: Then let me talk about this scene, I think that people's emotions, the relationship between people and people who are separated, many times, words cannot be reached. Or when we describe an emotion in words, that emotion will be further and further away from us.
In a sense, this narrow passage belongs to the two of them, and the physical distance is slowly transforming into a psychological distance, which also seems to be a portrayal of the relationship between the two, and I hope that this change can bring the audience closer to the inner thoughts of the characters. You can feel this part, which shows that it works.
What is the core of the director's most wanted to express in this work?
Wu Lang: In the movie "Snow Cloud", I hope to borrow a story to describe a kind of difficulty in life, which includes longing and helplessness in life. Like the ferry boat I was talking about, as we passed the piers to the island behind it, I knew at that moment that when the bridge was built, the ferry boat I was on would disappear and mine would disappear now. This makes me feel very interesting, it is also a core of "Snow Cloud" to convey, about life, about people's difficulties in life, and people's choices in difficulties.
If the audience can trigger a little bit of their own thinking about life when they see the life of the characters in the film, I think it's OK, it's open.
Do you have a private expression of yourself in the film?
Wu Lang: I think it's all the time. It's just that there are some things I feel like it's already there, and I don't need to describe where it's there, and the audience may be able to feel it as they watch. The author tells the film like you just said, the director always carries his own intention in it, but this intention sometimes through the characters, sometimes through a landscape, sometimes through a ripple on the surface of the water, this thing produces some linkage in it.
How did you conceive the appearance of the flock at the end?
Wu Lang: For example, the shadows of those sheep are a bit like the fear of the unknown, but when you turn around and hug the sheep, it is the part that is touched. Therefore, the flock that appears in different spaces and in different forms is a bit like the inner picture of people when coping with difficulties. Fear, hope, peace, and sometimes softness.
In your opinion, what does the flock symbolize?
Wu Lang: Inner softness.
In addition to the story of "Snow Cloud" itself, the cast is also very exciting, how did you come up with the idea of inviting them? I also saw the previous interview, which mentioned that Mr. Li Kangsheng was found by you by sending a private message on Weibo.
Wu Lang: Li Kangsheng is very special, he has his own rhythm and methodology in performance, which is very attractive to me. On the other hand, going back to the core of the expression of "Snow Cloud" that you just asked me, I think in a way, this story is like a stone in a river, it is immobile, and with this immovable slowness, we can feel the flow of the water around us, and this tension is what I want to explore.
Brother Kang gave me the state of immobility, his screen image is quiet and slow, and I learned about this person through his films before knowing him. At that time, I took the liberty to send him a private message through Weibo, and finally had the opportunity to meet and establish contact when he and his family were traveling in Hainan.
When I wanted to make a short film in 2019, Brother Kang suggested considering finding a professional actor, which was helpful for filming and could better realize my expression, and then I thought of Teacher Li Meng. I think Li Meng's screen image is very good, even if she stands there without speaking, her face is also a face with a story, just when I commissioned a friend to produce a film to inquire about the time and interest of Teacher Li Meng, because Brother Kang and Li Meng met, they were also contacting us, a bit like we were looking for her, she was also looking for us, so this fate allowed us to have this cooperation.
To me, Renko is a treasure boy, and we see that he usually writes songs, sings, writes his own novels, and is very talented. He has a lot of ideas to give the director a lot of possibilities, and the most we talk about is that the performance can be collected a little. If the weak water 3,000 only take one scoop, I can take that part and fuse with the character. On the other hand, although he is very lively, he is also a very dedicated person, and I sometimes feel that he is not like an actor acting in a feature film for the first time, so I think it is quite good.
After watching "Snow Clouds", there is another feeling, the image style of this film is impressive, how do you compose this image style?
Wu Lang: My own creative habits will pay attention to image thinking, followed by structure. The experience of creating sculpture is more important to me, whether it is simplifying complexity or creating something out of nothing, these two directions are very important thinking as a sculptor. When returning to film creation, I will invisibly borrow this habit of creation to think about what the overall image part of the film is and what its appearance is. So I think it has something to do with this creative habit.
Or let's ask another way, what aesthetic insistence do you have on your films?
Wu Lang: I'm not interested in replicating life. Exploring how to translate my perception of life into the language of images is the most important thing for me.
How were the final locations presented in the film?
Wu Lang: It took a long time to find the scene, and it took several years, and I think the film selection is very important, and I am also the "actor" who starred. Like that town, that boat, that bridge, that room. After choosing the scene, develop the story from this foundation. But even if you find the right scene, it is constantly changing, just like people. I would often revisit, like going to see a friend. Adjust the development of the story as the scenery changes, as well as the development of the characters.
We also have a question, you just mentioned that you studied sculpture in college, why did you want to work in the film industry?
Wu Lang: This process needs to be more real with yourself, to be real. From the sculpture department to making film, there are many things to learn, but fortunately I met my film enlightenment teacher, Professor Zhou Chuanji, and at that time I started making documentaries, learning musical instruments (timpani), learning audiovisual languages, learning editing, and so on for two years. After slowly building up his audiovisual experience, he shot experimental videos, and then devoted himself to the creation of film feature films.
Why make movies? For me, the question is, why do I create? I don't think that all creation is indispensable for film, only when this creative expression must be the medium of film, I will choose to make film.
Many times the feeling can also be done with a poem or a painting. When deciding to tell a story or complete an author's expression in the way of a movie, there must be its irreplaceability, and this irreplaceability is a homework I have to do.
So why create? For expression or?
Wu Lang: This question is the same as why people live, there is no answer, different people are also looking for why they live when they pursue life.
So what keeps you sticking to the creation of different media, what is the root of the core?
Wu Lang: I don't think about persistence, I'm just curious. Why did I go to make a movie? Going to paint? To do sculpture? What am I concerned about? And why care? Is it permanent or temporary? Maybe all my creation is just "because".
02
Li Meng
Women are a gift from God
The gift of this world
Did you prepare for the role of Su Hong before?
Li Meng: The most important preparation is to learn some haircutting skills in the barbershop, these crafts still need to be prepared in advance, and get along with the little girl Yaoyao.
What kind of character is Su Hong in your opinion? What are some of her characteristics that you particularly appreciate?
Li Meng: Su Hong is a relatively forbearant, but she will not endure everything, and she will not settle when she really touches her bottom line. Su Hong is a very naïve and honest woman, for example, she told Han Jiangyu that we should get married, but in order to buy a school district house for her children, so that they can settle down, she will tell Han Jiangyu the truth and will not lie to him.
Su Hong also has an awkwardness in her, she is not a woman who gives up so easily. For example, she went to the manager and said that all the information was complete, see if she could help, she invested all the money, there was really no way.
From the perspective of performance professional, did you do any special designs for Su Hong during the performance?
Li Meng: There was a discussion with the director about her and Han Jiangyu's reunion in ten years. When the lovers met again ten years ago, was the current reaction shocked or the shock lagged behind, how can that shock not be in a very deliberate design? So at that time, I felt that I didn't want to react at the moment, after seeing him, I still did all my action lines normally, went into the room to drink water, but when I drank water, I could see that Su Hong was a little excited, and then I went to communicate with Han Jiangyu, which is the design of this scene.
Su Hong's costume also adds a lot of story to the film, especially the orange-red long dress, did you discuss the choice of clothing with the crew?
Li Meng: The director's positioning of the color of the character's costume still wants dark red or orange colors, warm colors, because the movie is cool. The orange dress I bought on Taobao, I think this dress is particularly good-looking, especially suitable for Su Hong to meet Han Jiangyu, especially the boat scene. Wearing this dress is not to deliberately seduce this man, but to reflect the state of life getting better and better, she is ready to buy a house, and she is going to get back together with Han Jiangyu. It is still good that the color moves forward, not directly as a result of red, but as a process towards red.
What do you think of the relationship between Su Hong and Han Jiangyu? When I watched it, I kept wondering whether there was more love between them or more practical considerations?
Li Meng: I think this consideration is weakened, there are neither, more want to have a home with him, the family component is heavier. Because for Su Hong, longing for a home is the most important thing, whether love continues to go on or not.
The whole film looks beautiful, which scene do you like?
Li Meng: I myself prefer the scene of washing dishes, Su Hong came to Han's father's house, finished eating with Han's father and then went to wash the dishes, Su Hong finally said to Han Jiangyu let's get married. When I was acting, I felt that the tension of the emotional beauty of that moment was moving, not just the beauty of the appearance and the image, I wanted to be a kind of beauty from the inside out.
Let's talk about the end.
Li Meng: That ending was not designed, the sheep walked over by itself, it was really a stroke of God.
"Su Hong, Han Jiangyu, and Yaoyao came to the ruins and looked at the city, and their eyes were moved." This is the text of the original script. But when everyone went to the real scene, the sheep followed us into the empty temple-like place, and when Han Jiangyu and I walked to the middle of the picture to see the bustling scene on the opposite side, the sheep appeared in the picture. The director said it was it. Everyone was excited after that scene, and we finally shot the end of the movie, and instead of saying that we need to edit it, finding another ending is like a gift from God.
Thank you, picked up a good story, always thought that the sheep was designed.
Li Meng: It really passed by itself, and no one called it, it knelt down by itself. The point is that I have never acted with sheep, the first time I acted sheep and I were so close, it also made me feel very amazing, it turns out that the intimacy between humans and animals can be established in an instant, and I later asked where the lambs were and wanted to take them home to raise.
In your opinion, do you think that the appearance of this sheep at the end will symbolize something?
Li Meng: It seems to be a light in the ordinary world, in this barren world, no one knows your inner pain, or no one knows your inner happiness, no one knows your expectations, and confusion about life. But when the lamb comes, you will find that there is a light in your heart, and this light makes you feel that life has a head.
The image style of "Snow Cloud" is impressive, how did you feel when you worked with director Wu Lang?
Li Meng: From short films to feature films, I have been convinced from the beginning that Wu Lang is a very good person who knows how to use images to tell stories, and his images are very unique and avant-garde, and they are an aesthetic image at the world level. When we were filming the short film, there was a scene where Han Jiangyu helped Su Hong move, and Su Hong had to give him a moving fee, but Han Jiangyu had to take the money and leave.
In the picture, Su Hong was left standing in front of the house watching Han Jiangyu's car go away, and suddenly a strong wind blew up, rolling up all the garbage, plastic bags, and leaves on the ground. The director never shouted to stop, and I thought to myself that I must not shout stop, because I felt that if I didn't stop, emotions would slowly seep out. That gust of wind wrapped everything together, it was wonderful, it was transmitted by the wind. The director did not shout to stop until after the wind passed, and the director said that it was this shot.
In an interview with Voguefilm two years ago, you said that you felt that there was no satisfactory role in your life, and that the characters that seemed to you to be remembered at that time would have regrets, and only flawed things would be remembered. Is there still such an idea?
Li Meng: I think so. If you are really satisfied that you will forget in the future, I always think that it is regret to be remembered.
What are your expectations for the role you want to play next?
Li Meng: I want to play a more complex and feminine theme, and I hope to present more of all aspects of women, whether they are fragile or strong, and so on. Because the woman is a very wonderful animal, a gift from God to the world.
03
Don
Beauty is
The most contagious
How long did the later stages of "Snow Cloud" last? When I watched the film before, I said that the post-production was not completely completed.
Don: I think until the last moment, the director was a very refined person. The next morning it was time to mail the DCP to the festival, and the director was still working on the final grading details at three o'clock in the morning the night before.
Tell us about our initial partnership with Snow Cloud.
Donhe: The director was actually introduced to me by Mr. Shen Xuan. In fact, for a year before Wu Lang made the short film, we were in contact by phone because he lived in Haikou. But I read his early works, I read his scripts, and I talked to him on the phone, and I think he's a very unique and charismatic creator, so we started working together for a year without even meeting.
When looking for information, I found that it was originally to better obtain financing, so there was the appearance of the early short story "Snow Cloud", can you talk to us about this part?
Don: The public nature of "Snow Cloud" is not so strong, and there will definitely be difficulties in the financing process. So I suggested to the director at the time whether it was possible to present his ideas in a visible way. The director finally thought it might be better to make a short film, so we took the money ourselves to make a short film. The director is actually not a person who is good at packaging his own project through the concept of external promotion, his audiovisual is far more interesting than his story, when the short film went to the Shanghai Film Festival venture capital, although only a clip of tens of seconds was played, his lens and unique audiovisual language suddenly attracted others. That year, director Wong Kar-wai was the chairman of the jury of venture capital, and the director won the final award. In fact, the financing after the short film was filmed was still not so smooth, and in the end, the director's senior brother Mr. Liao participated, and friends including Mr. Sun and Renke helped to finish the film.
We originally wanted to talk about Renke later, did he have an investment or a friendship participation?
Donhe: I think the director is a very artistic temperament, in order to pursue his goals is a very direct person, maybe he does not have what we call the kind of concern, for example, he found Kang Sheng, or found Li Meng, including finding Renke, are all this single-handed mode to contact, but with his talent and his real things can impress each other, I think this is indeed what he is very attractive.
Renke didn't have that many scenes, but he was very, very cooperative throughout the filming. And three days after the final filming, the director told me that he felt that he might have to add a new scene, hoping that Renke could act, but at that time, Renke had a performance in Hainan. I remember that he finished performing in another city in Hainan, and he took the train in the middle of the night to finish the reshoot. If you want to use the standard of a commercial film to measure everyone's salary, in fact, there is no way to complete it in a literary film that is more independently produced like ours. Renko is very righteous to participate in our work to some extent, in fact, he also directly became a producer in the end.
Is the overall production of "Snow Cloud" still smooth?
Don: I think it's going well, and although there are a lot of inconveniences, as the director said in our private conversation, he especially didn't want to talk about the difficulties in the process of filming, because it is difficult to do anything. From my experience of cooperation, the success of any project must be the charisma of the leader, who can unite his creative team and stimulate the desire to perform, and in this regard, Wu Lang is a very unique person. In the end, everyone became fighters under his inspiration, and he kept coming up with new ideas and hoping for better presentations. If it weren't for his passion for creating and inspiring everyone, it would probably be impossible for everyone to stick to it. So I do feel that if everyone in the whole crew is more united, working in one direction, and the difficulties are overcome, it will seem smooth.
The weather in Hainan is relatively humid and changeable, does this bring any inconvenience when shooting?
Don: I think the climate is fine, because the director himself lives in Haikou, and he actually needs to capture the unique part of Hainan. To tell a short story, the sheep we ended up with were shipped from Guangdong, but the sheep ordered by the production team could not get on the boat, and everyone was very devastated because it was about to be filmed. As a result, there was another flock of sheep on board, and our production colleagues immediately put the flock down and rented it out for the final scene. There are really many situations encountered during shooting, and how to solve them may also be an ability of everyone, or a chance.
This flock of sheep is wonderful, because I interviewed Li Meng yesterday, and she also said that the lamb that ran to her side when the final finish was not designed by you, but by the sheep themselves.
Don: And the sheep, after the director proposed it, we discussed it together, and we bought the sheep and let it last for the rest of the day.
Where do you put it?
Don River: A local family in Haikou thanks for its participation in the show.
How does it feel to work with director Wu Lang and the leading actors?
Don: We actually had a very enjoyable whole process, but I think making a film is not based on whether people feel particularly smooth or not, I think the most important thing is to create a work, which is the most meaningful and valuable part of all our feelings. I think Wu Lang is very, very good, when he shoots so well, it is difficult as a producer not to consider other difficulties, but in the end I will still be moved by his creative production.
In your mind, what are your considerations for good work?
Donhe: I think the first is beauty, beautiful things are the most infectious, beauty may not be completely related to how much money is spent, it must have certain basic quality requirements, and Wu Lang's "Snow Cloud" from the title to the whole picture, and then to the mood of the whole story, is very moving. The second is that as a work that communicates with the audience, what kind of value the film hopes to convey is also more important to me. One is audiovisual aesthetics, the other is the value of text content, you have to ask me the standard, maybe the directors I admire or hope to cooperate with are also in this direction, "Snow Cloud" I like both of these very much.
"Snow Cloud" is the first Chinese-language film shortlisted for the Adventure Competition unit, what are your expectations for this shortlist?
Donhe: I haven't persuaded the director yet, the director first advised me to be normal. This is indeed the case, so I think Wu Lang must have some special young and calm places. He also told me that it would be great to be shortlisted, and that he was already talking to me about the creation of the next project. I myself feel that being selected by Berlin, especially the Chinese film that was shortlisted for the first time for Adventure, must be a great achievement. To be honest, of course, we expect to win the award, and we also expect the film to go further and communicate with more audiences after passing through Berlin. From a creative point of view, I think the director's attitude is also very good, the creation itself is over, and it is more valuable to move on to the next creation.
Interview, written by: Sibe
Design: Xiao B