Before and after "The Price of Madness" (below) - a conversation with director Zhou Xiaowen about the phenomenon of entertainment films in the 1980s

Wang Xiaolu/text

One

Wang: Tell us about "The Last Madness" (1987), which you shot to make money for Western Film Studios. The director gave you a script, and the screenwriter's signature was Shi Dongshan's two descendants: Shi Chenyuan and Shi Chenfeng.

ZHOU: These are the brothers, and they wrote a script, the name of which I don't remember very well, it seems to be "Pursuit". I took the script and read it, the police were very tall, and the film was naked and running for money. But for the task assigned by Wu Tianming, I must complete it, because people are interesting enough to me. So I realized that I had to shoot, but I couldn't shoot it so directly, and it was very painful and I couldn't sleep. One day, in the middle of the night or in the early hours of the morning, I sat up suddenly, woke up, and suddenly thought: Can the policeman chasing people and the so-called murderer being chased be "one person"?

I thought about it like this: they simply didn't have a mother, they all had only one father, so the two of them were a bit alike. The second thing is about the fugitive, his name is Song Ze, he is a murderer, I have to find a way to make the audience not see him killing, because the audience only believes what he sees and hears on the screen. I didn't let the audience see him killing, but I just let them hear that the wanted warrant said that he had killed someone, did Song Ze kill anyone? In this way, it is not as simple as a traditional police movie.

Wang: It's a very unique idea, and it's very modern today. It was China in the 1980s, how did you come up with the idea of making two people "one person", and what was the background to such an idea?

After I thought about this, I felt that "The Last Madness" could be filmed, and it would definitely be filmed well, and there would be no shame, so I dared to set up a film crew. It went very smoothly, because Wu Tianming asked me to shoot it, and in the end, the real purpose was achieved, I made money, built a dormitory building for the West Film Studio, solved the accommodation problem of many people, and made a great contribution to the West Film Studio.

Wang: Looking at it today, "The Last Madness" is very similar to a film noir, in fact, you have decriminalized the actor Song Ze, that is, he is regarded as a criminal, but in fact, it seems that he is not a criminal, and the audience is not sure whether he is a crime or not. This person was charged with a murderer, and later he really killed a person, although it was out of legitimate defense, but this is not clear, so his life can be imagined to be sinking all the way and desperate, and the audience has a sense of identity with this character, so the audience deeply experienced the life of this character, forming a very unique viewing effect. This is the psychological logic of film noir, I wonder if you subconsciously made it like this at the time?

Zhou: At that time, I really didn't understand the term "film noir", but I deliberately arranged a scene in which Song Ze asked a foreman who owed him money for money, because he had no money at all, and he needed money to flee. The foreman set up a power grid and wanted to electrocute him, but Song Ze picked up a fire extinguisher and sprayed it at the foreman who framed him, and the foreman himself hit the power grid he set up and was electrocuted.

This scene is more cunning, not only to let the censors see that he did kill someone, but also to let the audience understand that he is innocent and designed by others. This once again confirms from the side: Song Ze didn't kill anyone at all, so this scene is very necessary.

Wang: When I watched it, I found that the police and the criminals had love scenes and kiss scenes, and I felt the twin relationship between the two of them at that time, and in the end, both of them died together. I remember you said that the police completed his redemption in this way, what did he redeem, and why did he do such a destiny design?

Zhou: Before filming this movie, there was a real incident, I borrowed it, there was a policeman in Jilin, he found a bad guy on the bus, the guy had a grenade, the bad guy pulled the grenade fuse, there was about 3.5 seconds before the explosion, in this time, the police knocked down the bad guy and pressed on him, so the grenade only killed the bad guy and the policeman himself, and none of the passengers were killed. This happened before I was filming "The Last Madness", the Ministry of Public Security awarded this police hero and martyr title, I think that no matter what that person did before, pulling a grenade on the bus, which in itself is endangering public safety in a dangerous way, this is a crime, and at this time the police bravely pounced on this person and overwhelmed this person, he is a hero, enough to go down in history.

So, I referred to the Jilin incident, when the police confiscated the explosives in Song Ze's suitcase, they found that his body was also full of explosives, and the pull ring was put on his own fingers.

This design also saved the film's life. After watching it, the relevant personnel of the Film Bureau said that this is a very good film, no problem, but you are a police-related subject, and it must be reviewed by the Ministry of Public Security once. I was almost blindsided, you know? Because of my first film experience, or I would have gone to the Cannes Film Festival, where they had already chosen "They Are Young". "The Last Madness" is going to the Ministry of Public Security for trial again, and I am about to make a fool of them, and I asked if I can not go to the Ministry of Public Security for trial? They replied, "No, this is the rule."

In the auditorium of the Ministry of Public Security, it was full of people. Probably the comrades of the police were also interested, and there were still people standing.

I sat next to the director of the political department of the reviewer, and my heart tugged, sometimes peeking at his expression. I saw that he was very calm, and he kept watching like this. Once, in the movie, the director of the Public Security Bureau said that people hate us police, but once we lose something at home and our relatives are wronged, the first thing that comes to mind is our police. When he said this, the audience applauded, and they felt that someone had finally spoken for the police, which might have a little impact on the director. Then when the movie ended, many people saluted and applauded me, and I was saluted by the police.

When the police were almost gone, only me and the director of the political department were left, and he said a word that scared me so much that I sweated. He said, "Your movie is quite fresh, but I'm scared of this "but". He said, "I see that the equipment used in the public security bureau that you photographed is very advanced, but there is no such advanced equipment in Beijing, so where did you shoot it?" I said in Dalian. He said: With such advanced equipment and such a strong police force, helicopters have all been dispatched, and so many people have been dispatched to arrest one person, so why should our police officers die with him? My mind buzzed, and at that time, there were just three words, "It's over again." Then I had an idea, remembered the incident in Jilin, and immediately told him about it. The director asked, is this He Lei in the movie based on that prototype? I replied yes, he thought for a while and said, then it's okay, okay.

Wang: I found that another feature of your film is "The Last Madness", which consciously incorporates a lot of elements of the era, such as break dancing, rock bands on trains, and sensitivity to media elements, such as police chasing criminals, encountering a group of people suspected of shooting pornographic videos, and listening to phone calls. I believe these are all consciously designed by you.

ZHOU: It's definitely conscious.

Two

Wang: After The Last Madness, how did you start writing The Price of Madness, and how did you work with screenwriter Lu Wei and others?

ZHOU: It's also a very interesting process. When I finished filming "The Last Madness" and made money, Wu Tianming was very happy, he said, you can shoot whatever you want. I found one of Shi Tiesheng's novels, "Fate is Like a String", and talked to Shi Tiesheng in person, and he agreed to shoot it. I took this book and went to find Wu Tianming.

Unexpectedly, after reading it, Director Wu said that when you have time, you come to my office and I'll talk to you. When I heard this, I was so happy that when I got to his office, he gave me another script.

As soon as I saw the name, I was disgusted, the script was called "Gobi Bloody Road", which was a script about Sheng Shicai, an army general of the Kuomintang back then. It has a strong sense of commercial cinema. may really be filmed, and I can make some money, but I have already filmed "The Last Madness", and the little money that Western Film Studio gave at that time, more than 2 million, was not enough to make this movie. So I told Wu Tianming that I still want to shoot "Fate Like a String", which costs less money, 1 million, and can save half of the money. Then, Wu Tianming said something to me, I still can't forget it, he said, that kind of movie just let Chen Kaige and them shoot it, who are you? You are the number one (No. 1) of our Chinese commercial films, he said, you should shoot this kind of film.

Later, I led one of them out to pick up the scenery. After reading it, I thought it wouldn't work. I bought a copy of Reader's Digest during the scene picking, and when I turned to the last page, there was a tofu block article in the bottom corner, which wrote a story that happened in the United States, a mother with 7 children, the youngest girl was raped by gangsters, and my mother took 7 children to find the gangster for 7 years, and finally brought him to justice. After reading it, I suddenly had an inspiration, and I wanted to express the aforementioned metamorphosis of Chinese society in the 1980s, the hedge between the loess civilization and the maritime civilization, the distorted and embarrassing inner state of the young generation in China, especially young women, and the venting of this desire that is flying all over the sky. So, I returned to Xi'an, secretly went to our first deputy factory director, Ma Jilong, and told him my thoughts: I don't want to shoot "Gobi Bloody Road" anymore, and if I want to shoot something I can afford, I will shoot it in Qingdao. I want to push "The Price of Madness" up quickly, and I can save half of the money, the factory wants to give 2.4 million to shoot "Gobi", and we only need 1.2 million to make this movie...... Ma Jilong replied that it could be considered. He really dared to act boldly, and only made one request, to write the script within ten days and start filming as soon as possible.

My lord said, "Reed is the chief writer, and he wrote this script in ten days." Ten days, of course it's not perfect, there are still a lot of holes, but there's something. We took the script and gave it to Ma Jilong, and Ma said to get the money quickly, leave as soon as you get the money, try not to come back, call directly if you want the money, and I'll send it to you...... In this way, "The Price of Madness" was filmed.

Wang: The Price of Madness begins with a very powerful passage, a long shot of a group of women bathing naked. There are a lot of nudity in the films you make, and on the one hand, maybe it is a narrative need, and on the other hand, it was very ahead of its time at the time. The young people in "They're Young" are all wearing shorts and naked, which is of course necessary because the environment is like this, but it is still very impactful on the screen. There are also many human bodies wearing only underwear in "The Last Madness", and even in "Youth Without Regrets" in the early 1990s, there are Zhang Fengyi's nudes. Of course, the naked bath of Wu Yujuan (the actor of the heroine Qingqing in the play) in "The Price of Madness" has become a famous topic and event at that time. I think you're very focused on the appeal of this senses.

Zhou: That's how I see nudity, either you don't shoot it, or you shoot it generously, and don't block anything, otherwise it's very boring. "The Price of Madness" was simply filmed thoroughly, of course, in order to pass, I still created a little hazy atmosphere with water mist, but I didn't block it at all, not even a piece of cloth, this is a feeling I have about the human body. There is another way, I think the human bodies of those soldiers in "They Are Young" are actually not beautiful, some are very thin, some are very strong, because they are such a group of people, and they don't have to be like Schwarzenegger to be soldiers, as long as they are basically healthy. It was in a humid and hot area, and they couldn't wear clothes at all, so it was very normal for them to not wear clothes.

As for "The Price of Madness", Chang Rong (the actor of the actor Sun Dacheng in the play) doesn't wear clothes in some muscle training scenes, who still wears clothes when he sweats so much? As long as it is a reasonable plot need, if you don't wear it, you don't wear it at all, especially women, when the camera is there, they shake it away and shake it to the sky, this practice is too disgusting, it is better not to shoot. There's also about kissing, in "The Last Madness", both the cop and the criminal have kissed their girlfriends. To be honest, I was especially afraid of filming Chinese kiss scenes. The kiss scenes in Chinese movies and television are simply unsightly, and I was very worried when I was filming these two scenes, but for the purpose of the plot, I had to shoot them. You find out that no, their kissing is not affection at all, it is venting. The police were on the march, and he didn't know whether he was dead or alive, so he pulled his girlfriend over and kissed him.

Wang: In addition, I think Chang Rong, who plays the rapist in "The Price of Madness", seems to have other meanings for his nudity. Chang Rong plays the criminal Sun Dacheng, but he is very good-looking, youthful and masculine, he is a little hysterical because he is suppressed, and he feels that his body is tortured by youth as if it is about to explode, I feel that the movie has shaped him into an incarnation of desire, or the incarnation of hormones. But in terms of styling, he didn't belittle him at all, and he was always full of sexiness.

ZHOU: That's what it means. You can see it very accurately. Chang Rong is young, muscular and strong, if you cite the actor with the strongest hormones back then, it will be Chang Rong, there is no second one. At that time, China's household registration system was very strict, he committed something at home, fled from his hometown, and fled to his brother, and his brother was afraid that he would see people, so he locked him in the tower and didn't let him go out. From this point of view, there is no doubt that bullying an eleven or twelve-year-old child is a loss of conscience, but from the fact that he was suppressed by his brother and society before, he is a victim. Chang Rong played Sun Dacheng, he lost his conscience in desperation, and I designed it like this.

Wang: In Chang Rong's room, there are posters of Stallone and photos of Ferrari cars, how did you think about shaping his character in these art designs?

Zhou: Sun Dacheng, played by Chang Rong, is hormonal, muscular, young and energetic. He is not highly educated, but he likes to read crooked books, such as the "Qingqing Book House". At that time in 1988, there were no good books sold in the waiting room of the train station, all of them were "your man rented to me" and "Confessions of a lost woman", etc., and there was a famous magazine, which sold very well in those years, called "Southeast and Northwest", from the first article to the last article, it was all about men and women.

The bookstore opened by the heroine Qingqing's boyfriend Xie Yuan is named after Qingqing, and the bookstore sells all such books. He said, if the bookstore is full of "The Complete Works of Tolstoy" and "Selected Works of Guo Moruo", do you see it? I have to live, I have an old mother and a younger sister, I have to take care of them, and they all have to eat, so all the yellow books and periodicals he has outside are all spread out, and that was a scenery in 1988, although this scenery is not very beautiful, but that is the reality, the reality of that year.

At that time, "First Blood" and "Second Blood" were on fire in China, and it represented a kind of toughness and strength. Of course, there are all these things about hormones and so on, but this kind of hardness and strength, I think it's a double-edged sword.

That's one of the main reasons why I wanted to make The Price of Madness. Society is beginning to move towards clarity, affecting young women like Qingqing. Qingqing can represent many young women in their early 20s at that time, who grew up with traditional education, and who were abandoned by their parents' divorce or hated their parents' divorce. She hated and resented this kind of openness of sexuality, but she herself was in the prime of her youth, and she was a midwife, and she could not have no desires, and it was impossible for her not to want such things. So Qingqing is a torn and contradictory figure. This caused her to be so intolerant of the fact that Lan Lan was bullied by Sun Dacheng. She had to find the young man, in a city of millions of people to find someone she didn't know at all, she asked Lan Lan to recognize it, Lan Lan had already said it, it was dark, and she couldn't see it clearly. But she still wants to do this, and borrows someone's broken camera to shoot. What does this mean? It shows that she can't tolerate her sister, who is so many years younger than herself, getting sexual experience before herself. It's not so much that she wants righteous revenge, but that she wants to see what this person really looks like.

Wang: So there is another meaning. There's also a sexual curiosity in it.

ZHOU: Yes. So in the end, when she finally met Chang Rong on the tower, the police handcuffed Chang Rong as well, and before she kicked it, the two of them looked at each other. When I was looking at each other, the camera was moving slowly, and Qingqing's eyes were also looking at it, and the two of them were looking at each other. It just so happened that both actors studied acting when they were in school, and both acted in the play "Romeo and Juliet". I said, now you are Romeo and Juliet, a pair of inseparable lovers, of course you know that your fate is to die, but you are lovers to the bone marrow. The two actors are very good, and they have completed the two shots of each other. It's all lovers' looks, and Juliet and Romeo's family are at odds and are not allowed to be together. This society is the same, and they are not allowed to have any connection with each other.

Wang: At the end of the film, Wu Yujuan kicked Chang Rong off the tower in front of the police, which is a very bold design, because this is revenge, not legal justice, and this behavior is a relatively extreme expression in the film at that time.

ZHOU: Yes, the heroine broke the law here. This kick is the price of madness, she must make Chang Rong pay the price, but instead of making him pay, it is better to say that the heroine herself is crying and making trouble to pay the price.

Wang: I found out that "The Last Madness" and "The Price of Madness" were both filmed by the sea. "The Price of Madness" was filmed in Qingdao, and the scenes selected in it are all German buildings, why is this happening?

ZHOU: In the 1980s, there was actually a talk of yellow civilization and blue civilization. I've heard people say that there is a clash between these two different civilizations, and it's already being studied, and I'm interested in that. I think that whether it is the blue civilization, the law of the sea, or the law of the continent, it will have a certain degree of influence on me, who is right and wrong, who is high and who is low, who is civilized, who is barbaric, I will naturally have my own conclusions, but I think that in a movie, it is better for the director not to give an answer, just give a process. The answer should be in the hearts of the audience.

Wang Xiaolu/text