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Steve McQueen interview: "These stories are timely until things change completely" related

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Estimated reading time: 10 minutes

Steve McQueen interview: "These stories are timely until things change completely" related

It took Steve McQueen 11 years to get a chance to complete the film series Small Axe (2020), which tells five stories surrounding London's West Indies community from 1969 to '82, from the Dub and Lovers Rock balls to the trial of the Mangrove Nine.

Part of the film is set against police bias and atrocities, and McQueen's passion project feels even more urgent and necessary in the wake of the killing of George Floyd and the Black Lives Matter protests that have swept the world this summer. Here, the director recounts the ideation and filming process of his most ambitious solo work to date.

"Little Axe" was planned for 11 years and produced for 6 months. When you finish production, how does it feel to say goodbye to the team?

Because of the epidemic in the new museum, this goodbye is a bit difficult. The situation of not being able to drink hugs from colleagues feels strange. It's weird when you should be at this moment of celebration, or when you should have a closing party but miss the rituals you should have. It was a very peculiar farewell. At the same time, we are also in the process of finishing up. While we were talking, there were still some small details that were being completed. So, it will show what it should be.

So you ended up before the pandemic happened?

We finished the production, but there were still 8-10 days or so to stay before the crew disbanded, which was a wonderful time for everyone to get together again. We were the first crew to shoot on location during lockdown, and of course all the testing and precautions were very strict and serious.

Steve McQueen interview: "These stories are timely until things change completely" related

When I talked to cinematographer Shabier Kirchner about Little Axe, he made the point that in making this series, you were writing untold stories into history, not rewriting history.

It's rewriting history because it's looking at everything in a different way. When you implant things into history, everything changes because your view of things changes quietly, for example, most people in the UK think about the police. For decades, the black community has been talking about how bad the police are. For a long time in Britain, there was a slogan, "The best cop in the world". But now that we all know about the West Indian community, we see the police very differently. So that changed history, changed the way we thought about that institution. Now they know what happened to those people, the undercover cops' relationship with the Stephen Lawrence family, and all the dirty tricks they used against the families involved in the protests, and so on. And that's just the tip of the iceberg.

In Mangrove and Education, they almost recreate the style of the time.

It also has to do with colorist Tom Poole. What I pursued was how to shoot that era with KodakRom film. Mangrove has an epic texture to me, starting in the middle of nowhere and ending in the highest courtroom in this country. Frank opened a café in a remote corner of Radburk Street in London's western suburbs, only to come to old Bailey, who represented the justice system. To show the trajectory of this thing, it had to be 35 mm film, and at the same time, Kodak Chromium film was also a photographic tool of that era. It is not intended to show what it is today, but what it was then. So that's the key to getting us into that world. I've always been interested in watching Gordon Parks, not necessarily his composition, but the colors in his work. And William Eggleston of that period.

Steve McQueen interview: "These stories are timely until things change completely" related

You shot each of these five films in different formats.

It's a great option if all five films are shot in 35mm or digital format, but what interests us is the beauty of each story. For example, Love Song Rock is a digital movie. It's shot digitally because it's flowing. We want to capture things in the flow of sound. Filmed in 16 mm, Education reminds me of a BBC series called Play for Today, a BBC series of period plays that aired on BBC1 from 1970 to 1984. I think it was every Thursday night and they would have some little movies, usually very topical. I remember those movies that impressed me. It's not that they're granular, but they're going to hold you tight. Maybe it's because the themes of these films are very contemporary... It keeps you fresh in your memory.

So, I knew I definitely wanted to shoot Education at 16mm, but there were still a lot of problems with image transmission, but the BBC was very accommodating in the end. Alex Wheatle (2020) was shot with Sony Venice. Again, it's an interesting journey. Because that story has a heartbreaking, Elia Kazan-like element, it takes a rate of exposure to deliver an epic quality similar to that of Red, White and Blue. But at the same time it's very critical, and it involves a lot of family, so I'm going to deal with it that way.

Is there a lot of breaks in between the shooting of each movie?

No, it was made to make money. But as a British filmmaker, I know at least one thing, and time is money. We need to learn how to deal with it. It's incredible. When you understand the budget you fucking never believe it. How many movies have you seen?

Three. Aren't Alex Whittle and Education still being colored?

Almost. You only have one chance to see something for the first time, so you should go to see it because their purpose is to be seen.

Steve McQueen interview: "These stories are timely until things change completely" related

Do you think the fast pace of production affects the look and feel of the film?

What I'm trying to say is that people say I shoot fast. But I don't feel that way. I've never been on someone else's set. Obviously I'm pretty fast, but I don't really know what that means. When the conditions are in place, it is ready to proceed. Not to mention that there was a meticulous shooting plan before. The project has been going on for 11 years, and along with producer Tracey Scoffield, there's a screenwriting room, and that screenwriting room is constantly evolving, with all sorts of auditions, with writers I want to work with, like Courttia Newland, Alistair Siddons, Alex Wheatle told me about his own personal experience. This has been planned for a long time. Helen Bart and I have done more than 150 interviews in our quest for material. When you get to the point where everything is ready and only owes the east wind, let's start shooting.

Shabbir also told me that in the climactic scene in Mangrove, in which Althea (Letitia Wright) confronts Frank (Shaun Parkes), who is considering giving up, you ask him to leave the scene entirely in the hands of the actors. There is light, but the movement of the lens is determined by themselves.

Nothing is accidental. The first time Frank saw it was the first time the audience saw it. There's nothing planned other than what you can see. There is no such thing as a natural thing that happens by luck alone. No luck will come and solve the problem. Because I didn't know what he was going to see and the audience didn't know, we did a lot of design and careful planning. That's very exciting! Everything is dynamic! That's why this tension is put into this discussion, and it's one of the most important scenes in the movie! Frank was challenged! Are you standing with us or betraying us? You want to be directly involved.

In this series, you work with different crews, and the way you work together is different from your previous films. Do you consciously want to make these films in a different way?

I don't know what a "difference" is. The theme of the film determines how I shoot it. I'm not going to take a fixed template and say I have to shoot it this way. I'm here to serve the story. Of course, it's with my hands, but I have to listen to the story in my own way, to understand what the story wants and needs.

Steve McQueen interview: "These stories are timely until things change completely" related

The term "timely" is often used to reduce the problem of a film that happens to have a black struggle theme to just the problem of the moment, when in fact it is an eternal battle that has been going on for a long time since we could find the cause.

"Timeliness" isn't really a degrading, or exclusive feature of black movies. Any type of film can be timely at any point in time. As a result, it doesn't entirely focus on black films or black subjects. In fact, we're talking about what happened to George Freud this year and comparing it to Little Axe — that could happen at any time, and it's going to be timely. Until things change, unfortunately, these stories will always be timely.

Love Song Rock was shown at the New York Film Festival at a time when we needed dopamine the most.

It is a celebration of all sensations, sensual pleasures and sexual desires during isolation. To me, it's just a sign that we take a lot of things for granted. I am very grateful for the huge response to "Love Song Rock" after its release at the New York Film Festival, but at the same time it also requires our reflection. If we can't learn something during this period, we'll never learn a lesson. I think we've all learned what to do with our lives. I'm not trying to put some pressure on this film, it sounds like everything has to be taken seriously.

Obviously, it's a story about partying, about falling in love and finding yourself. I think it's because people lack the kind of feelings that people have with each other in Love Rock during lockdown, which in some ways adds to the sense that we take everything that happens in the movie for granted. That's it. We deny those things that are taken for granted until we see that it is precious. Maybe this movie helps people do that. Anyway, I hope it can do that, and if it doesn't, hopefully it can make people love Reverberating Music (Dub) and Love Song Rock a little more.

I guess you'll listen to the tracks from Love Songs Rock over and over again during the production process. After being exposed to music for so long, how did you achieve a sense of rhythm?

Listening to that music is intoxicating. I never get tired. And I always find something new in it. It's not a problem at all, in fact, it locks you up in some way. I don't have that problem at all. It was a joy. A real joy.

| Translation: Yu Fan (@Fan Translation)

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Steve McQueen interview: "These stories are timely until things change completely" related

British producer and critic, co-founder of the short film distribution website dedzafilms.com, whose film articles have been published in Little White Lies, Sight &amp; Sound, Filmmaker, American Cinematographer magazine and MUBI.

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