The Paper's special correspondent Jimmy Boy
In the new work "Seven Weapons of Haruki Murakami", the author Cai Hengping shares with readers the thoughts of reading Haruki Murakami at home in the early days of the epidemic, and sorts out the seven elements that often appear in 14 works of Haruki Murakami from "And Listen to the Wind" to "If Our Language is Whiskey": choosing major events as the background of the times, love and death, sex, wine, music and literature, special changes or supernatural events, and the daily life of literary temperament, which is a personal "air conjecture" that unfolds on Haruki Murakami's literature.
Recently, The Paper interviewed Cai Hengping and talked to him about Haruki Murakami.
Cai Hengping, born in Fuzhou, graduated from Peking University, and published works such as "Ancient Golden Weapon Spectrum" (later renamed "History of The Outer Rivers and Lakes") under the pseudonym Wang Pihua
The Paper: When did you start paying attention to Haruki Murakami? What appealed to you about his work?
Cai Hengping: I actually knew about Haruki Murakami as a writer for a long time, but I have never seen it. The epidemic in 2020 was at home, and there were his books on the shelves at home, and at that time, everyone didn't know when the epidemic would end and they couldn't go out, so I picked them up and read them one by one. His book is quite slow-paced and suitable for passing the time when there is nothing to do. You read one, you want to read another, and it took you more than a month to read all of his books.
I watched it in order, the first one I watched, "And Listen to the Wind", then I looked down, and then I slowly saw his doorway. The first two or three books, which he had written as a literary enthusiast, had a career job at the time as a bar owner. I later read his official website description, he liked American literature when he was a child, he also translated American literature, liked to listen to rock music, so he should have a literary gene, and then he wrote. It just so happened that his first "And Listen to the Wind" won the award, and if he didn't win the prize, he probably wouldn't write again, I guess, he was ready to sell the bar after writing two or three books, and decided to become a professional writer, so he slowly formed his routine after that.
He reached the top very quickly, it should be the fifth "Norwegian Forest" reached a very high height, and then he had a position in the literary world, the publisher was willing to sign, he was willing to send something, so his road was relatively smooth, if he later did not sell so well, such as the fourth and fifth works, it may not be that he will write again. It's all possible.
The Paper: "Seven Weapons" comes from Gulong, and what is the meaning of combining Haruki Murakami's "Wen" and Gulong's "Seven Weapons" as the title of the book?
Cai Hengping: This is also the natural use of a stem, because after I saw Haruki Murakami, I knew that these things were mainly in his routine. I originally wrote a book called "Ancient Golden Weapon Spectrum", and later renamed "History of Jianghu Wai", which was written about gu long and Jin Yong's characters. So I am very familiar with Gu Long's book, so I took Gu Long's "Seven Weapons" and thought it was good, this sentence is also very symmetrical, and the title of the book "Seven Weapons of Haruki Murakami" is so on.
"Weapon" is actually a "routine", it is not really a weapon as a weapon, but a general reference to a routine.
The Paper: "Seven weapons" or "routine" means that Haruki Murakami consciously compiled it in his work when he wrote it, or did he not have this consciousness, but you distilled these?
Cai Hengping: You asked this question particularly well, which is the interrelationship between an experienced literary reader and a writer. My judgment is this: he was unconscious at first, at least when he first wrote the first three books. People generally write things, involuntarily will write what they are familiar with, he grew up familiar with Western literature, rock music, and as a bar owner, he will write a lot of music, literature, wine.
But later, after he became a professional writer, he needed to write large novels, because it sold well as a book, and I think he consciously used [some elements], for example, the most important thing is to use major historical events. In fact, he does not use these major historical events as a background, and his book is also established, but the tension between these major historical backgrounds and stories will become particularly large.
In short, these are all technical things, a long novel it has to advance, if there is no supernatural event as a turning point in the development of the plot, his plot is difficult to advance.
Then, without describing the literature, music, sex, and wine in large quantities, he would not be able to go so far. Of course, you have to say that of all these seven weapons, the first six other writers can also master, and also know these "routines", why can Haruki Murakami succeed? It is because of his seventh weapon, "the daily life of literary temperament", the same sentence, he wrote a literary nature stronger than many people, it is like, everyone knows how to play football, but Maradona plays very well, he is an artist, probably this is the truth.
The Paper: You just mentioned the issue of length, is it possible that Haruki Murakami would not use the background of the times when he wrote it for the sake of filling the space?
Cai Hengping: Those routines that others make are not as good as he makes, that is, he becomes part of his personal style as soon as he makes them, and becomes an organic part of him. For example, the evaluation of Bob Dylan rock, he wrote a sentence that is particularly bullish, to the effect of listening to Bob Dylan's songs, like a child watching the rain outside on a rainy day. This kind of words cannot be written by others, but he can write them.
The Paper: How to verify that he uses these elements consciously in the back and unconscious in the front?
Cai Hengping: I can't verify it either, I'm just a person with perennial reading experience and literary judgment, so I'm still waiting for when I have the opportunity to meet him and ask him.
The Paper: What is the basis or criterion for judgment?
Cai Hengping: It's because he repeats these elements in almost every book, but he can write very successfully. For example, writing about sex, he has a lot of sexual descriptions in each book, of course, all of them are very well written, and they are not repeated.
The Paper: You just mentioned "experienced readers", how do you think you can be called "experienced readers"?
Cai Hengping: It's hard to say. Literature belongs to the category of art, not even a social discipline, so although literary studies also have certain routines, it is difficult to say that the answer is unique.
But at least I know very well the types of literature, know what pure literature, genre literature, and what varieties and general characteristics of genre literature are. For example, Haruki Murakami is very successful as a professional writer, but he has tried at key moments, when exploring the darkest part of human nature, but he is not willing to dig up again, because those things may be to face life, bloody, or ordinary people do not want to touch, do not want to see. So Haruki Murakami said that he was Dostoevsky Garremond Chandler, because Dostoevsky experienced a lot of things in his life, and even as a companion to the death penalty, that is, he thought he was going to be shot, but in fact, he did not, he heard the gunshot, the spirit had a major blow, and he was entangled with the issue of religious belief, and his works also confronted these magnificent times and changes in his personal heart.
Of course, I believe that not many people other than literary researchers would really enjoy reading Dostoevsky's face to human nature. Back to the question of how to judge is an "experienced reader", in fact, as an ordinary reader, if you are not a person who makes a living from literature, there is no need (that), that is, Haruki Murakami's book I picked up, read it with relish, and got a lot of reading pleasure; Dostoevsky's books I read are terrible, I don't read them, it's nothing. But those who have literary training can see the difference. For example, a person who understands music will know the difference between popular songs and operas.
The Paper: In fact, when talking about Haruki Murakami, it may be often not only a discussion between people inside and outside the literature, but also the difference between those who like Haruki Murakami's works and those who don't like them. Under this premise, what are the obvious characteristics of "experienced readers"?
Cai Hengping: I have a certain degree of familiarity with the genre of literature, distinguishing between pure literature and genre literature, and can distinguish between them. Secondly, he has a database of trained readers of Haruki Murakami's memes, writer's works, sex, alcohol, etc., which fragments can be compared with each other, how he wrote it, and how others wrote it. For example, his "Dance! Dance! Dance! "Write about the attraction of the little girl to the male protagonist, and immediately after reading it, I will compare Nabokov's "Lolita", and I will have associations and analogies to see which one is better written or which I like more.
"The Seven Weapons of Haruki Murakami", Cai Hengping/Author, Oriental Publishing Center, March 2022 edition
The Paper: "Seven Weapons" refines the key words of Haruki Murakami's works, and these refinements will also solidify the ambiguity of writers, and one refinement is a kind of solidification. Are you concerned about the criticism associated with this?
Cai Hengping: You said it very well, not a keyword can be summarized, this is something I have some personal characteristics, I like cologne, appropriation of his "seven weapons" statement. Then I think haruki Murakami's original work is there, and people who really care about his ambiguity will continue to read his original book and understand it for themselves. I don't think it matters, it doesn't prevent others from doing a different kind of understanding. It may objectively form a certain reading effect, but I really didn't think about it.
Writing things is sometimes a painful process, but I wrote this book is a very happy process, a bit like guessing why he wrote this paragraph, that paragraph so written, and then I thought I might guess correctly, and I laughed at myself.
The Paper: In many literary works, these "weapons" are also common themes in literature, such as the first three elements of "love and death", "sex" and "wine" are important elements in Osamu Dazai's "Oblique Sun". As a weapon of Haruki Murakami, what is special about it?
Cai Hengping: Yes, I will say that he was able to organize them well with his literary talent, and as a reader, knowing that he was this routine, or willing to follow him, this is where his success lies. I haven't seen Osamu Dazai's, so I can't compare. But I think so: love and death itself is the theme of literature, and literature has been written throughout the ages, wine, music, and other literature, which writers like, but because Haruki Murakami's works write a lot of these, I will summarize them, so I think he wrote very well.
To really say his characteristics, one is a supernatural event, and the other is a daily life of literary temperament. Supernatural events are used a lot at the turning point, and when you read a book, you will feel how the supernatural events have not yet come out, and you will be relieved when they come out. This is his characteristic, but in fact, this is his worst place, only if he can't make it up, he needs to rely on supernatural events, right? "The daily life of literary temperament" is what I just talked about, and I can feel that he wrote very well, but those paragraphs are difficult to translate into film and television language. For example, writing a sandwich, cutting the sides very thinly, freezing the cucumber very cold, and then cutting it into silk, and then how to drink beer, how to watch a football game, how to take a bath, those daily descriptions are too unique. Words of the same meaning, others write may be explanatory text, or a running account.
The Paper: In this book, "cure" is the word you repeatedly mentioned to evaluate Haruki Murakami, which originally meant "to restore health" and "cure cure", which is now Chinese common Internet word. How do you understand the meaning of "healing"? In your opinion, why is this word popular in today's society?
Cai Hengping: You said that this question is particularly good, the word "cure" is also what I have learned over the years, I think it is particularly accurate, I understand that it is mainly the meaning of "soothing". When I evaluate Haruki Murakami with "healing," I am reading that moment and give me a soothing, calm, less intense stimulus.
Why is it especially important for our time? According to my reading experience, probably before World War II literature, it is rare to see others use the term "healing", indicating that one of the pain points of our time may be anxiety, because only anxiety needs to be soothed.
The Paper: The book is more than 140,000 words, of which citations also occupy a large space.
Cai Hengping: I think it may have to be half and half, or it may be more than half.
The Paper: Whose translation is not marked in the book, and it seems that Lin Shaohua's translations are the most?
Cai Hengping: Yes, mainly quoting Lin Shaohua's translation, there are one or two translations of Shi Xiaowei. My next book is called "East And West Pulls," and I'll probably get two-thirds of the citations. There is a very famous scholar in Germany named Benjamin, and his ideal is to write a book that is all made of quotations, which is a particularly wonderful idea, and I want to realize it. Now that I've implemented part of this book, the next one will be more, and of course there will be more books involved.
The Paper: You also mentioned that reading Koyev's comments on Sagan, you thought of Haruki Murakami as also a "global writer", and mentioned the corresponding concept of "national writer".
Cai Hengping: What do global writers mean? That is to say, Haruki Murakami, who happens to be a Japanese person, he writes in Japanese, but his works are not for his homeland, nor are they sold only to readers in his homeland, but to readers around the world who like him.
So only when can this be achieved? Only after the end of the Second World War, a number of developed countries, that is, the post-historical era we call, is an era of security and prosperity, and it is technically possible to realize that a book can be published in the same period around the world. The contrast between what is written and what is written by national writers is no more or so strongly national. My anxieties, my troubles, my stories and even the location of my stories are familiar to readers in all developed and emerging economies around the world. I bought something in Kikuniya in Tokyo, watched a football game broadcast, where I went on vacation in Greece, probably the whole world, and I can understand it. You can write it in Japanese or you can write it in English. There was no such possibility in the original era, and after World War II, and some writers have realized it, haruki Murakami is one of them.
The Paper: You also have a "literary product" in the book, "Global writers do not write to represent the motherland, but to provide suitable literary products to the target readers of the world."
Cai Hengping: Cultural products are very normal, a professional writer, professional singer, professional football player are similar, such as professional football players to play in the league, performance to his audience to see, professional writers he may have to come up with a work at about a certain time, and then have to see how he sells.
The Paper: These may not be "products", not finished products or items produced by agriculture or industry. Literature is a product of the spiritual world, and the definition of "literary product" may dissolve something personal.
Cai Hengping: Cultural products are different from manufacturing products, manufacturing products are standardized production, right, cultural products actually want to standardize, but its core part involves personal talents and genes. Why is Maradona better than others? His talent and genes for football are indeed better than others, and he can kick the ball in the same move. Similarly, writing a long story, there are countless people on the earth every day who are writing long novels, but there are not so many people who can sell it, there must be a reason, his personal ability and talent account for a large proportion of this product, unlike industrial products, as long as the workshop management is standardized, the quality of each product is the same. The level of two works before and after a writer will be different, and the state of a player in different seasons will be different. That's roughly what I understand.
The Paper: You just mentioned that "literary products also want to be standardized", but the most attractive thing about literature is not its standardization, but its difference.
Cai Hengping: Yes, you said it very well, he can't do it, but he is trying to get infinitely closer to this thing. For example, in the subject matter of literature, poetry and short stories are more difficult to popularize, and the long novel itself contains the gene of popularization, the earliest in the golden age should be serialized in the newspaper in the 1820th century, such as the French Balzac writers, basically for the newspaper, strong story, with popular characteristics. If you're not a professional writer, have a good job or wealth, and writing is a hobby, then you might create a particularly personal product, it doesn't matter if it's good or bad, just want to like it. However, the formation of literature has an industrial chain, why should the publishing house sign this writer? Why did you publish this book? How do you want to sell? There's a whole set of stuff behind it. But as you said, the only insurmountable thing in this set of things is the core part, the writer's talent, ability, craftsmanship, experience, which is the biggest difference between cultural products and other products. A professional writer must face the chain behind literature.
I actually felt very early on that literature itself may not last long, because there are more and better alternatives. For example, I think that a good American drama is better than a lot of novels, and American dramas like "Game of Thrones" are really very good.
The Paper: Good literary works cannot be replaced by images, because some of the moods and emotions conveyed by words cannot be visualized. Of course, in turn, good film and television works, the conveyance effect of words may not be comparable.
Cai Hengping: You said that this is particularly correct, so I guessed so, I originally wanted to write in the book, but I didn't consider maturity, so I didn't write it. I am not talking about my own understanding, but I am judging a trend in the development of cultural consumption. Haruki Murakami's "Norwegian Forest" has been adapted into a movie by different directors, but it is not successful, the core is what he wrote about what I call "the daily life of literary temperament", those things are difficult to express in film and television, and can only be felt by reading words.
Editor-in-Charge: Gu Ming
Proofreader: Ding Xiao