Exclusive dialogue with Guan Hu Liang Jing: "Dog Formation" subtracts Peng Yuyan, and values his wildness more

Movie Island Awards

2024-05-23 19:25Published in Shanghai, senior media person, film critic, and manager of the Movie Island Awards

Tencent Entertainment and the Movie Island Awards have exclusively launched the filmmakers' self-narration dialogue column "People in the Play" - listen to them talk about themselves, movies, and love.

We invited director Guan Hu and producer Liang Jing to listen to their story with the movie "Dog Formation".

Although I have seen director Guan Hu and producer Liang Jing on many occasions before, I can feel that their state is very different from the past when I reunite with them at the Cannes Film Festival this time. In the domestic environment and system, they are already leading mature creators, who have created many popular models, revealing a calm temperament, and this time when they came to Cannes, they felt no different from the fledgling creators who came here, and they were still excited and enthusiastic. As they say: in Cannes, they are still newcomers. And the newcomer should have the appearance of a newcomer, not only to have the awe of art, but also to have a sense of honor. When Guan Hu premiered, the sentence "This is my first time coming to the Cannes Film Festival, and I will come often in the future" left a deep impression on all the audience.

The film that Guan Hu and Liang Jing brought to Cannes this time is "Dog Formation", which tells the story of Erlang, who had just been released from prison in a northwest town more than ten years ago, returned to his homeland, faced with prejudice and defense, and he didn't know how to start a new life. After being forced to make a living to join the dog fighting team, Jiro rescued a stray black dog, and he also gained the courage to hit the road again in getting along with the black dog.

The author's style of "Dog Formation" is strong and the narrative is complete. The story line of Jiro and the dog is very clear, and it is very touching to see the passage in the second half where people and dogs grow up together and redeem each other. Guan Hu's movies have always strengthened the integration and confrontation between human nature and animal nature, many years ago he filmed the ostrich in "Bullfighting", "Lao Paoer", and the image of a white horse in "Eight Hundred". This time I photographed the dog, and I especially discovered the coldness, loyalty, loneliness and sense of fate in the dogs, which have a lot in common with the role of Erlang.

Through the narration of Guan Hu and Liang Jing, a very intuitive feeling is that the cooperation of directors and producers is very important in artistic creation, especially film creation. As a director, Guan Hu needs to let go of a lot of baggage and get back to the wildness and courage when he first started making movies; As a producer, Liang Jing needs to escort the director to the greatest extent, especially to protect his "willfulness" and purity this time.

For Guan Hu at present, shooting such an artistic work as "Dog Formation" is more of a process of charging and adjusting oneself, charging is to start again, which happens to be the theme of "Dog Formation". Life is really too fast now, and there is very little time to stop and tidy up and even do some reflection and retrospection. But in fact, soon, he will devote himself to the filming of the commercial blockbuster "East Pole Island", and Guan Hu also expressed his approval of the creative path of "walking on two legs" that I summarized.

Liang Jing has had more in-depth contact in the field of art films in the past two years, and films such as "Street Baby" and "Little White Boat", which she is the producer and producer, have been shortlisted for the official Cannes unit. When it comes to the mentality of making art films, Liang Jing feels that art films will never disappear, because everyone needs to stop in the process of moving forward, and when a person wants to stop, art films will especially glow with its value, which is also the motivation for her to insist on doing this.

The following is the self-description of director Guan Hu and producer Liang Jing, who shared their stories with the movie "Dog Formation":

Guan Hu:

Animality is the real theme of the story "Dog Formation", and everyone has animality in them. When filming "Eight Hundred", I said to Zhang Yi that you want to play the feeling of a cat, Jiang Wu wants to play the feeling of a dog, you can watch the house, and Ou Hao is like a wolf. Since everyone has animal nature in their body, why do they grow up and lose all the way? In fact, when people are young, the animality in the body will be stronger, and when we grow up, we begin to follow the rules to play a social role, becoming more and more restrained and gentle, and the animality will slowly be sealed in the dust. But Peng Yuyan's Erlang is unwilling to be dusted, he still wants to go on the road again and rejuvenate his life. Jiro could have seen the end of his life at a glance, but because of this dog, it became a mutual comfort between two living beings, and his dreams and desires were stimulated. I think human animality is very precious, for example, we often see people climbing rocks and daring to challenge the limit, it is actually to satisfy the innate characteristics of the body, and "Dog Formation" is to help everyone find those most primitive things.

It is actually very rare to be able to create such a creation at this age. For me, we just graduated from film school, so we are relatively independent, and we make expressive films. Later, when there were more opportunities, it was natural to immerse yourself in the industrial system. When the pressure of commercial attributes comes up, you will find that the desire to interact with the audience in the body is still very strong, just this time, the pressure is not so heavy, you can do a favorite thing to the fullest, a bit like charging, but also a bit like relief, just like an actor who always performs in a movie has to return to the stage, return to zero and start again, athletes also need to rest in order to jump farther, I think this is a good thing.

Of course, people are constantly growing, and the concept of cinema is inevitably changing. Doing this at this time today, you will definitely experience a lot of doubts: why did you want to make this work? What's the point? But the more I questioned, the more I thought about it, the more I awakened the feeling of wanting to fight again, it's the same as Erlang, this time I just returned to the psychological state of filming student homework after graduating from film school, but the way of filming is very different from that time, and the expression of desire and maturity will also be greatly improved.

I originally came up with the idea for this story because I saw that there are many people like Jiro on the Internet, and there are many places like this. When I really had the opportunity to go to the northwest, I found that such an environment was indeed real, full of stray dogs; Including special weather, a hot day in August, sudden hail from the sky, making the body quickly hypothermic. In this kind of scene, there is such a kind of people who survive. It reminds me of the opening ceremony during the Olympic Games, when my brothers and I were watching the opening ceremony in a bar, when suddenly a phone call came to me saying that a very close relative in my hometown of Linyi, Shandong Province, had passed away. Later, I wondered, if the machine was put under the same conditions, what would his life, theirs, be like? Just like the Olympics, the most typical event that represents the great changes in Chinese society, what is the feeling of other people outside the "city"? I think it's the responsibility of cinema to put the machine in that position, not just the big city.

The reason why our story is called "Dog Formation" is because for me and the people I know, life is all arrays, and the same group of people are often active in your life. Do you have the courage to break out and start over? It's the same with dogs, I have 5 dogs, and dogs together have a great power, and sometimes they have the same feelings as people.

In terms of the choice of scenes, we basically did not have close-ups this time, and most of them were long shots or more objective documentary shots, which was different from the style of my previous films. However, I think the style is not deliberate, but the words go with the pen, there is a kind of natural meaning of the article, once it is formed, it will be naturally revealed. Human beings are small, and they are even more insignificant in the natural environment, and we must see through this, which can be explained by the scenery.

But at the end of the movie, we gave Jiro a big close-up, as an individual life, he is great, he is incomparable, life deserves respect, the two poles I mentioned above are generated in Jiro, I hope that the audience can feel through the image.

Jiro's relationship with his father is a very important clue in the movie. Because my father passed away last year, I believe that father and son are generally difficult to communicate with. When I was filming "Lao Paoer", I walked on the set with my dad on my back, and I could feel that his life was fading little by little, and his body had become light. In fact, later, we already have the desire to reconcile, but because we are not used to expressing it directly, we can't talk about each other's hearts. These things are possible in the movie, and this point can never be bypassed in the hearts of Chinese. If we let Jiro and his father have a tendency to reconcile, I believe most people will feel sour, but if they are completely reconciled, it will be too dramatic, so I still left a more regrettable but worth remembering ending, Jiro stayed by his father's side and watched him pass away. Peng Yuyan himself can understand such emotions very well, so he can quickly take on the role.

As for photographing animals, it is not so difficult to get started, especially dogs are very spiritual, and people can interact and communicate, you just need to respect its habits, make a lot of preparations, and have great patience. Like the scene where all the dogs in the movie lined up to greet Jiro, it was not done at once, but the machine was set up in the desert, unable to move, and many strips were shot separately, and finally composited. On the whole, we didn't encounter great difficulties in filming and production this time, and the difficulty and pressure of industrial production often lie in the commercial attributes it carries, but this time it was very incisive and very happy, especially I am happy to deal with dogs, so the whole creative process is very good.

Guan Hu and his father Guan Zongxiang, Guan Zongxiang played the second master in "Lao Paoer".

Peng Yuyan and I have been friends for many years, and the northwest town presented in our story will live in real life with people from all over the country, people of all colors, but in the end they are gradually converging. is like Erlang played by Peng Yuyan, he has to conform to this environment, but also does not conform to this environment, which is particularly difficult to grasp. The reason why I looked for him was because he had a different temperament and a tall figure, and it was different when he stood in the crowd, but at the same time, he had to do subtraction, discard the upright figure, and make some rough makeup, plus the character himself has aphasia and is unwilling to speak, so I accelerated to help him find that special sense of proportion that seems to be nothing.

People often only see him handsome, but what I value more is his wildness. It is difficult for him to show this fierce wildness and the loneliness in his body in many movies, in fact, he doesn't have to act, as long as I set the state for him, he will naturally show it. Of course, the process of dealing with dogs is also more difficult, and it also requires patience, the kind of dog we are looking for is not close to people, it will just run and catch, and it takes a lot of time and energy to want it to be close to people. Peng Yuyan is very serious and dedicated, trying again and again to run in again and again, and in the process he is more and more familiar with and tacit understanding with dogs.

I also invited director Jia Zhangke to play the role of Brother Yao this time. The section chief is the kind of person who makes it easy to believe that he is a person in the environment, and as soon as the character setting has a direction, I thought of him immediately, and he said he was willing to come without asking what the script was, and he guessed that I might want him to grow a beard, so he really didn't shave. There is a photo taken between filming, the staff is eating lamb skewers, and the section chief is roasting by the fireside, I almost didn't recognize him, and I heard that he grilled the skewers very well. I really think Jia Zhangke is amazing, on the one hand, he is a writer, a film businessman, a good director, and at the same time, he is such an actor who can stand at ease in the crowd, and is naturally natural and real, which is really a talent. He filmed our scene and stayed in the group for a long time, after all, he is the second male lead, and he is the one with the largest number of lines in the whole film.

Tong Liya and I are too familiar with each other, and we worked together when we were filming the movie "Revolutionary". We have read a lot of information, this kind of performer woman who walked the streets and alleys with the circus back then, many of them looked as beautiful as Yaya, and they usually didn't wear makeup, they were very casual, so it was extremely suitable for Yaya to act. Of course, there is also Zhang Yi, who was pulled by me to make a cameo when he came to visit the class. I am very grateful to these friends, after all, this is a film with strong authorial expression, and in the case of unknown market prospects, everyone can help you without reservation, it is really out of love.

This is my first time at the Festival de Cannes. I think that after our film market recovers, what we need to think about is how to integrate with good films from different cultures in various countries, let's learn from each other's strengths, at least we maintain innovation in film language. The film festival is a window, and this path is more important for me at this stage, including this time I saw Coppola's "Metropolis" and was very excited. I felt that I should step out of my array and break through.

Everyone's perception of my work may be commercial, but creation is actually the same as boxing, you need a few jab punches, and then a heavy punch, and you will be tired to death if you want to punch and punch - commercial and authorial works must be interspersed. After finishing "Dog Formation", what we are going to do immediately is "Dongji Island", which is a special genre of big commercial films, and will continue to make a relative author's movie in the future. It's like we just talked about, it's definitely not good to charge and relieve yourself, and it's definitely not good to do it continuously, and there is no freshness in the language, so my plan for myself is to walk on two legs and keep the fun of the movie. "Dongji Island" is a shipwreck movie that I especially want to do, and the finished "A Man and a Woman" is also an interesting attempt, I create in a different environmental culture, I can't understand Cantonese, but I just want to show the feelings of people in different cultural atmospheres, this movie is quite literary, many people think it's not quite like what I made, but what it presents and expresses is also what I want to say through the movie.

Overall, "Dog Formation" is still a movie that focuses on the little people. When I was a child, I grew up in an alley, my parents were not around, and until I was 12 years old, I was still running crazy every day, and no one cared about me. Unlike the growth experience of other children around me, all I want to see are some small people, and there is no so-called big person. Later, my father returned to Beijing Film Studio, and I saw a lot of big stars at once, Li Xiuming, Liu Xiaoqing, etc., and the upside down of the world gave me a great impact when I was a child. In addition to the commercial function, movies also have a reminder function, many times we forget a lot of things when we live, and want to relive our own lives, or perceive other people's lives, except for the form of movies, it is very difficult. I hope that this film will be seen by more people, not so much because it needs to be commercially successful, but because I want it to really enter the hearts of the audience.

Liang Jing:

Coming to the Cannes Film Festival, the biggest gain is that I have strengthened my belief in continuing to make "good films". Cinema is supreme in our hearts, and it is difficult to treat it simply as a commodity, it should be a work that belongs to the creator's heart. So when we see young directors who have a unique perspective of self-expression and a distinctive image style, we are very willing to help them, after all, we are also helped by others. But the market situation of art films is indeed cruel, its living space is too small, but the market needs these films with personality and niche authors. This is also a time for those of us who are so-called mature filmmakers to show their value. For example, the young director films "Street Baby" and "Little White Boat" produced by our company have been shortlisted for the official unit of Cannes, and their reputation is also very good. Of course, as a producer, I must be the first to bear some cost pressure, but I think this is the attitude that should be used when making films. The first film of these directors was able to go to Cannes without any problems, and I felt that everything was worth it.

For director Guan Hu, filming "Dog Formation" is a process of rejuvenation, and after creating several successful commercial films, it's time to look back and find your original self. At the beginning of the project, many people asked why such a film was made? Why do you want to go back to making art films after finally establishing the brand of "commercial director"? I was a little worried about his rhythm, but he was very persistent, a little unpleasant, and I quickly agreed with the director's decision, and we had to be in step to move forward smoothly.

The process of entering the official unit of Cannes "Un Certain Regard" was quite smooth, and although director Guan Hu is a very mature director in China, he is still a newcomer to Cannes. I can feel the inclusiveness of Cannes, which focuses on the work of young directors who are new and have new ways of expressing themselves. We can feel that the Cannes Film Festival has become more and more deeply aware of and recognized the culture of Chinese films, which is also what we are particularly pleased about as Chinese filmmakers.

In terms of shooting, we must try to satisfy the director's ideas to the greatest extent. The filming location is in a small town in Jiuquan City, Gansu Province, a town that is about to be demolished, as empty as the script, with no lively popularity, no vitality, and no zoo...... The zoo in the script was transformed by us, and we had to find a way to transport all kinds of animals from other places, these are big projects, including hundreds of dogs, and after the dog team we found brought the dogs, we built a dog kennel covering an area of about two or three acres, tons of dog food, and more than 20 maintenance personnel and dog trainers alone.

Compared with the large-scale work of "Eight Hundred", "Dog Formation" is definitely another difficulty, but the director enjoys it very much, as if he has returned to the state when he just graduated, and there is no longer so much commercial pressure. He did a lot of subtraction this time, all the shots and images are very restrained, even if it is the emotional heavy scene that should be fluctuating in his heart, he does not give close-up shots, deliberately does not fill the emotions, and I think the way of handling it is very advanced. In real life, there are really not so many full emotions, they are all fleeting, sudden and indifferent...... The director himself has been through a lot, and he has captured the real state of people growing up and recorded them in a cold and restrained way.

The loneliness and loneliness faintly revealed in "Dog Formation" is actually very similar to the director himself, he is a state that enjoys loneliness and is uncomfortable when he arrives in the crowd. He is even more reluctant to show himself in front of others, he hopes that life can be pure, and he doesn't want to be disturbed by too many noises and distractions, even if it is flowers and applause. I think sometimes he is like a tiger in a cage, his animality seems to be bound by the rules and regulations of the adult world, and he wants to find a relatively free self in a limited space. When he is not working, he likes to stay by himself, just watch movies at home, watch three to five movies a day, and watch any type of film, and constantly recharge himself. I am very satisfied with the current state of work between the two of us, we are making up for each other's shortcomings and pulling each other forward.

Over the years, I have learned a lot from his creation, and his image expression and the interpretation space created are very interesting. Sometimes you will find that it is not a good thing to give things too much, I have been watching foreign films such as "Red", "White" and "Blue" since I was a child, although I didn't understand it at the time, including domestic "Red Sorghum" and "Yellow Earth...... A lot of my aesthetic consciousness is what these movies have brought to me, and I think movies should be like that. Of course, we will also do some more commercial content, especially dramas, the company and the team need to survive, but as a creator, a lot of things have been integrated into my body, and these cannot be lost. So even if I don't make money, I have to do it, and I can't be in a hurry, many young directors are very anxious now, I want to say how many films have been made by director Guan Hu, and I still have to return to my original intention, we must stick to ourselves, and we can't waver because of the voices around us, so we will also pass on this attitude towards movies to the young directors who work with us.

We also had fun with the choice of actors this time. We told director Jia Zhangke that there is a character in the movie, please come and make a cameo for us. Because we have worked with director Feng Xiaogang, I think the collision between directors is quite interesting. There is also director Zhang Jianya in the movie, he played Commander Cai in "Flowers", and director Zhang Yang and Zhang Yi were directly pulled by us to play a role when they visited the class.

And Peng Yuyan played Erlang, which I recommended to Director Guan Hu. Although Peng Yuyan feels very handsome, the director and I feel that there should be all kinds of people in any environment, it doesn't matter whether he is ugly or handsome, what matters is how to make the audience believe that he is a local. Director Guan Hu has always liked to find some actors who are lost in the crowd and can't be seen as actors, which is the creative logic that the director has always adhered to, so the director's styling subtraction for Peng Yuyan this time is also very successful. When we got Eddie done, he was so excited that he couldn't see himself in the mirror. At that time, a few friends who had a good relationship with Peng Yuyan came to visit the class, and they didn't recognize him after watching the scene for a long time. Peng Yuyan's handsomeness is a personal label for him, which is very similar to Erlang. Erlang is a person who is not good at words, not that he can't say it, but he doesn't want to say it, and this society has already had a certain misunderstanding about him; Like the dog, everyone said it was rabies, but it wasn't. Jiro and the dog are the same, with various labels on their bodies, and their encounter is like looking in a mirror. Eddie himself is a very simple person, and he is even simpler in the crew, that is, fitness, filming, sleeping, no other requirements, and he does not like to party and drink, he has the characteristics of Erlang. Director Guan Hu just saw his characteristics, and then dug out the things he needed from Peng Yuyan.

Every time someone asks us how to become a good actor, we answer the same thing, if you want to be a good actor, you must endure loneliness and have enough patience to wait for opportunities. Zhang Songwen is the best example, he has always had a very good relationship with director Guan Hu, the director has always asked him to be an acting director, and he was also the first to ask him to play the male lead on the big screen ("Revolutionary"). After "Hurricane" became popular, we are really happy for him, he is a good actor who can endure loneliness, because he has precipitated all the experience and skills in his body, which is enough to have the ability to catch a good opportunity. This is the basic quality of a really good actor, and this quality is also possessed by Peng Yuyan.

After several years of exploring and making art films, I feel more and more that at the beginning of my creation, I have to figure out who my films are made for and what the future direction is. Whether it's a producer or a director, the two of them must reach a consensus. I don't have much confidence in the current development space of art films, but I believe that it will never disappear, because everyone needs to stop in the process of moving forward, and when a person wants to stop, art films will glow with their value, which is also the motivation for me to insist and have to do this.

People have different genes in the human body, I am lucky to live in the film world, movies have given me too much, I can be happy to do what I like to do, this is my ideal and that of director Guan Hu, we go forward with a group of people who really love movies and understand movies, how far and how far we can go, just like the sentence that has been repeated in the movie "Dog Formation": "Hold up your chest and move forward, the sky trees and sandbanks ......" That's it!

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